1 00:00:49,320 --> 00:01:03,550 She. Sean. 2 00:01:03,550 --> 00:01:48,800 So. So. 3 00:01:48,800 --> 00:02:18,250 First, the rhetoric not so to day. 4 00:02:18,250 --> 00:02:26,630 For Oshun D'Haiti. I sent her on. 5 00:02:26,630 --> 00:02:37,710 Embody beauty, dignity. And rope, uh, peacocke or incarnate, uh. 6 00:02:37,710 --> 00:02:56,840 So, yes, I hear her calling, I answer, yes, Cindy is Cindy. 7 00:02:56,840 --> 00:03:04,770 On waking dewdrops open gifted sites. 8 00:03:04,770 --> 00:03:18,560 Rising a gifting suites, sold gifting, most precious, most fecundity has. 9 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:28,090 Each day I rise, each precious moment watching. 10 00:03:28,090 --> 00:03:37,880 Being in yet watching, immersed in sanctuary, held Saturday in rising. 11 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:53,320 For each day bodes well. For life, a new life, a renewed life, new birthing. 12 00:03:53,320 --> 00:04:06,280 Life, new birthing for she comes Kalkat, this be the first blush? 13 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:15,880 Gliding her smile belies voyages, long run, said her testimony. 14 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:26,650 Oh, but of broken wing recovered like Phoenix, she'll be rising advanced sidestep this reveal no one to move, 15 00:04:26,650 --> 00:04:34,380 no sly side in the who she comes raining Sottile. 16 00:04:34,380 --> 00:04:50,030 She'd be sensing horizons blue inviting. Like Phoenix, she comes rising. 17 00:04:50,030 --> 00:05:09,940 Imbibing, sweet honey. Stirring fecundity rocks, she sobs, Aria dreams, she thread's love poems, she notion's belonging shoreline's sensing anchor. 18 00:05:09,940 --> 00:05:50,890 I see molten ashes tumbling, rises like Phoenix, possibility cascading soft facades, takechi fluttering on the water's edge. 19 00:05:50,890 --> 00:05:59,350 So. Can I truly offer me. 20 00:05:59,350 --> 00:06:04,900 Less expecting secret wounds, B.C. 21 00:06:04,900 --> 00:06:14,780 Exposing in the prima matter materia sinew channels to solar chamber. 22 00:06:14,780 --> 00:06:22,300 I tried to find. Newborn, naked, holding, sweet sensory. 23 00:06:22,300 --> 00:06:30,710 Celestial revelry tenderly crafted on the moon and its. 24 00:06:30,710 --> 00:06:40,500 Magically trace through dream flight gilded offerings to encounter beloved. 25 00:06:40,500 --> 00:06:49,020 To encounter beloved as in life and being. 26 00:06:49,020 --> 00:07:05,090 Vitally invested deep within be akin, feeling like dancing over hot coals, soon jumping river deep in the in your gifting. 27 00:07:05,090 --> 00:07:22,950 For foibles, then them nowhere needs them be stitched, Creed's honouring fidelity to life's tapestry for less such topology I'd be busting. 28 00:07:22,950 --> 00:07:37,780 Wanting emotion, red relief for foibles, strengthen footholds on earth walls to eternity and. 29 00:07:37,780 --> 00:07:49,710 Foibles make human. Make for sweet meanders through loves poppy fields to veritable embrace. 30 00:07:49,710 --> 00:08:00,510 Oh, yes, I believe. Oh, yes, I believe I believe I can truly. 31 00:08:00,510 --> 00:08:34,580 Oh, yes, of all. Of. 32 00:08:34,580 --> 00:09:27,510 So. So. 33 00:09:27,510 --> 00:11:25,760 So. So. 34 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:37,430 Incense, smokes, heats, barely writes music or UPB. 35 00:11:37,430 --> 00:11:49,060 Sahar. Oh, how sweet it is, huh? 36 00:11:49,060 --> 00:12:05,990 How sweet it is. A rising incantation. 37 00:12:05,990 --> 00:12:31,240 As moon sets, dawn breaks Insight's new day unfolding, how sweet she be in moments blossoming dream states to Earth Plane being. 38 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:46,990 Now to capture joy, break essence, to hold her, to carry her front and centre just, oh, blossoming. 39 00:12:46,990 --> 00:13:04,890 That cherished Wandera, be the Gauntlett, be the Clarion, be the imbibing foshee on the waking Zeb presents it be palpable romancing. 40 00:13:04,890 --> 00:13:39,260 Oh. For footsteps to virgin territories, call for all the vigilantes, all the eco vision, all day, 20 20 in the moulding to undulating said. 41 00:13:39,260 --> 00:13:48,680 Life, river beings, oh, how sweet she be, the cherished moments owe that to the calling. 42 00:13:48,680 --> 00:14:14,010 Oh, how. How sweet it is. 43 00:14:14,010 --> 00:14:26,880 Waste beads, serenades. For it requires a certain gaits. 44 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:40,060 To carry dignity intended to carry femininity, rolling waves into honey ravines across covid, wasted and hit. 45 00:14:40,060 --> 00:14:47,990 All roads lead, they say it is in the curl of your lips. 46 00:14:47,990 --> 00:14:53,970 Initiate the swing of your hips and show them girls. 47 00:14:53,970 --> 00:15:10,500 So the, um. Roll those hips in that certain gates beat songs crafted through colour style and ch'ing generations invested from Chic to see. 48 00:15:10,500 --> 00:15:18,230 Sweet fecundity is your prerogative. To be all woman, May says, show them girls. 49 00:15:18,230 --> 00:15:21,840 So the four, as you walk, 50 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:32,970 can weigh in and you can weigh in and can weigh in and feel the power of your being from a single 51 00:15:32,970 --> 00:15:44,560 [INAUDIBLE] to cascade Harmony's beaded waist and churning your hips for it takes a certain feline gates. 52 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:57,760 Celebrates your rolling hills, Carrie, your serenade, there's no space for bashful brominated, this place is yours, Miss Claymates. 53 00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:06,220 Work it, girl, cause you hold the power. It only takes one cheek. 54 00:16:06,220 --> 00:16:12,520 How I arrested you have them alert, ready for you, 55 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:24,650 but it's pretty hot and and you hold the reins because it's sweet like that may say, Oh, fade to black. 56 00:16:24,650 --> 00:16:41,440 Yes, but the. Venus sensate. 57 00:16:41,440 --> 00:17:04,130 Celebrate your venus' sensate. Hold her hold her hold as you walk, express her in your talk. 58 00:17:04,130 --> 00:17:16,500 Uh, uh, hold her in your gaze. 59 00:17:16,500 --> 00:17:25,430 How far she is yours to behold, offer her to the world, they are waiting, they are one thing, 60 00:17:25,430 --> 00:17:46,530 my goddess, this is no time to just come make manifest, hold her bosom close, take strides. 61 00:17:46,530 --> 00:18:07,430 Unfurl your Venus Sensorites. 62 00:18:07,430 --> 00:18:29,700 And for she loves you well, she loves you well. 63 00:18:29,700 --> 00:18:35,750 Hmmm, this cabinet of curiosities. 64 00:18:35,750 --> 00:18:41,830 What to call it, barely. Stomached. 65 00:18:41,830 --> 00:18:59,480 Nature, hmm, detached colony's, disembodied, gaily coloured flowers adorn this cabinet of curiosities. 66 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:13,870 In tempo laced heart rhythm, she rises. She falls, she rises, she falls in temple place or skis, and she rises, 67 00:19:13,870 --> 00:19:27,130 she falls confidence and now holds Venus Gates because she rises and she falls. 68 00:19:27,130 --> 00:19:44,340 Hmmm, sweet melody, rugged rhythm, divine bejewelled sensorium, she rises and she falls, you know, for sake we. 69 00:19:44,340 --> 00:19:54,330 This cabinet of curiosities breathe deeply, exhale m brace, she barely stomach hmm, 70 00:19:54,330 --> 00:20:10,850 that cavity she your belly stomach sweet sanctuary, the enigmatic cabinet of curiosities. 71 00:20:10,850 --> 00:20:24,810 Mobile museum, she holds Varity Enrobed as she comes folded, fleshy mine, she comes just fiercely feminine around its soft folds, 72 00:20:24,810 --> 00:20:38,840 its mama warrior not tendrils are caving nine months incubating life form so blessed. 73 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:52,180 She mobile sanctuary holds. Verrity. 74 00:20:52,180 --> 00:21:06,070 And roved she comes, Foldit, fleshy, sensually, embracing me. 75 00:21:06,070 --> 00:21:38,120 First rhetoric. Now, so today and I saw today. 76 00:21:38,120 --> 00:22:50,240 No. So. Oh. 77 00:22:50,240 --> 00:23:02,570 Flower me friend, the call to the flowering is a beauteous thing not to sense, just to. 78 00:23:02,570 --> 00:23:14,050 Since her. Deeply evolving in the flowering. 79 00:23:14,050 --> 00:23:38,300 A call to encounter this, a call to rest next on Petzold Bed, find release in the weave of new narratives, threatening matriarchs such as. 80 00:23:38,300 --> 00:23:53,690 Woman siren in velvet, red beheld in delicate lace caress into a cocoon called desire. 81 00:23:53,690 --> 00:24:17,690 Dismantle ancient imagery, ignites Picasso emotional memory, evoke a vision fiction as reverie evoke desire me say, hold up, hold down this. 82 00:24:17,690 --> 00:24:28,100 Desire a key colour in the tapestry of free desire desires, I come to me, 83 00:24:28,100 --> 00:24:37,460 I flower me free, poised, open, released I as rose petals unfurling suspended in slow, 84 00:24:37,460 --> 00:24:50,600 feel enticed in the free flow in the flowering essence of me, like circling honey bees, diving for the honey pot, silver tongued with lyrics. 85 00:24:50,600 --> 00:25:06,170 And yes, they seek to possess me. Oh reflections of the flowering in me for this is no fluttering. 86 00:25:06,170 --> 00:25:36,200 For as I flower me free, desiring and being desired is a constant state of me. 87 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:44,540 Poised and flowering mode, blossom, sweet, sanctified, I emerge at will volition to pursue desire, 88 00:25:44,540 --> 00:25:52,800 pursued the fire, activate that which lies cause sensual in sinew. 89 00:25:52,800 --> 00:26:00,720 Nurture or nature, the long held debate. I sit, I observe, I sensate for those women. 90 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:03,000 They run with the wolves smile, smiling, 91 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:17,670 then knowing they know their fortune wrapped around treasure trove for fecundity, fecundity wrapped in similarly. 92 00:26:17,670 --> 00:26:35,880 The ability to craft the notion of free stories of the flowering, the blossoming to free liberation, no hardened arts of protest, 93 00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:49,260 no pistol whipping shapes and fires, this liberty so often self denied, is a call to dwell in self to behold. 94 00:26:49,260 --> 00:27:00,870 Yes, to be held, desiring and being desired is a constant state of me. 95 00:27:00,870 --> 00:27:22,650 I simply be flower me free. 96 00:27:22,650 --> 00:28:47,330 The. For the matriarchs, them say. 97 00:28:47,330 --> 00:29:00,750 Oh, Miss Demetriades then said. 98 00:29:00,750 --> 00:29:34,880 Oh. Keep the fire burning for smouldering embers, they signal danger, may say keep the fire burning. 99 00:29:34,880 --> 00:30:26,320 It makes of them, they said it made me ask them then say, keep the firemen. 100 00:30:26,320 --> 00:31:08,420 That's the rhetoric, not so to the not so, so, so so they so they use the rhetoric. 101 00:31:08,420 --> 00:31:49,230 First, the rhetoric says. 102 00:31:49,230 --> 00:32:18,360 Restaurants are now sold to the. 103 00:32:18,360 --> 00:33:40,880 OK. Thank you all again for coming to this. 104 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:47,870 Slightly alternative instalment of the great writers inspired home series. 105 00:33:47,870 --> 00:33:55,470 I think it's safe to say that the St. Luke's Chapel hasn't seen or experienced something quite like a performance of yours. 106 00:33:55,470 --> 00:33:59,330 And thank you very much for coming and sharing with us. 107 00:33:59,330 --> 00:34:03,440 Thank you. Yeah. What why? 108 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:10,400 We invited Diane to come and join join our series, along with more sort of traditional, 109 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:22,190 you know, bound book writing authors is that literature is varied and vast. 110 00:34:22,190 --> 00:34:29,270 And the ways that we engage with poetry in this case might be very different if we 111 00:34:29,270 --> 00:34:37,250 were sitting alone at home reading a book or reading a poem printed on a page, 112 00:34:37,250 --> 00:34:44,060 or if we're in a venue like this with other people sitting in a circle listening to somebody performing. 113 00:34:44,060 --> 00:34:52,790 So I think my first question to you, Diane, is how do you see the relationship between the text of your poems and the performance? 114 00:34:52,790 --> 00:34:59,210 And what does it mean to perform the poems? Are they alive in performance or are they alive on the page? 115 00:34:59,210 --> 00:35:04,310 Or is there are they different kinds of lives within like say good evening, everyone. 116 00:35:04,310 --> 00:35:09,590 Thank you. Thank you for your audience. It was a pleasure to perform for you. 117 00:35:09,590 --> 00:35:15,040 The question to break it down for me again, please. 118 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:23,150 The relationship between the text of your partner's. Yes. And the performance of the. 119 00:35:23,150 --> 00:35:31,970 When I see my poetry written or even when it's coming to me, you know, usually it just comes out like this. 120 00:35:31,970 --> 00:35:43,040 When I'm off the line, I may be moved by an emotion, a question that I'm asking myself. 121 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:52,400 Maybe I just wake up with often I will wake up and actually parents will just come out and I know that I will read it and experience the poem one way. 122 00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:58,610 So I have a poem, for example, which I didn't perform tonight called Piercing Peace. 123 00:35:58,610 --> 00:36:06,100 So piercing as in pieces and peace as in peace p a, c, e. 124 00:36:06,100 --> 00:36:10,250 Now, if you were to just hear that, you may interpret that differently. 125 00:36:10,250 --> 00:36:17,600 So there's definitely a difference between reading it and even hearing it, I think, 126 00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:25,730 because obviously when you're hearing it say you weren't seeing me physically, you would hear intonation, you'd hear energy. 127 00:36:25,730 --> 00:36:33,920 And every time I perform them, they're different depending on the context. You know, it was really hot in here today. 128 00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:49,930 You know, it's a very warm atmosphere. The relationship between the poems and performing them for me brings another dimension of physicality, 129 00:36:49,930 --> 00:36:57,420 of enlightenments enables me the opportunity to. 130 00:36:57,420 --> 00:37:09,690 The process, if I can describe it, is I really internalise what it is that I'm feeling and I move from the emotion and that then informs my movements. 131 00:37:09,690 --> 00:37:17,400 This particular piece is again quite different because I might generally recite in my movements always within my recital. 132 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:20,780 That's just how I perform. 133 00:37:20,780 --> 00:37:28,790 Working with the sculptors put in another dimension again, because, you know, there was a relationship between what these sculptures represent. 134 00:37:28,790 --> 00:37:34,340 So without wishing to pre-empt what you may be asking, just to add another layer, you know, 135 00:37:34,340 --> 00:37:47,540 when you have objects in the piece that I had around my head and the drum as well, you know, we made a choice just to use a singular term. 136 00:37:47,540 --> 00:37:51,290 That in itself is a language and it's a. 137 00:37:51,290 --> 00:38:01,250 There's a rapport between the music, the way in which I drop my movements and the words and the sense which I'm trying to convey. 138 00:38:01,250 --> 00:38:07,100 So it becomes quite a complex into a relationship and quite a dynamic one that I see. 139 00:38:07,100 --> 00:38:11,390 You know, if I have to look at an image would move like this. Mm hmm. 140 00:38:11,390 --> 00:38:15,620 But for me, if I was to say in one word, what would that be? For me, it's about enrichment. 141 00:38:15,620 --> 00:38:19,520 It enriches the offering. Mm hmm. 142 00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:22,910 And the poems or the offering? Yes. Well, for me. 143 00:38:22,910 --> 00:38:30,300 For me, the entire thing is the offer. Yes. From the minute you step in, that's the offer that was absolutely needed for you, 144 00:38:30,300 --> 00:38:34,940 because I was going to ask you about the sculptures and I was going to ask you about the vacation as well. 145 00:38:34,940 --> 00:38:43,430 But I think that you've summed all that up. So then another aspect of performance, I guess, is the presence of an audience. 146 00:38:43,430 --> 00:38:53,890 Yes. And so what in your mind is the role of the audience in the work in this kind of setting? 147 00:38:53,890 --> 00:39:00,550 The title of this work is First The Rhetoric, Not so today, so not so today in West Africa. 148 00:39:00,550 --> 00:39:04,660 You'll hear it in English speaking West African countries. You'll hear it. It's a patchwork. 149 00:39:04,660 --> 00:39:12,670 It's kind of slide which seeks for an affirmation of something that maybe we're experiencing or we've witnessed. 150 00:39:12,670 --> 00:39:16,210 So it's a call to bear witness. 151 00:39:16,210 --> 00:39:23,380 That, for me, is where I've put it, so today on the end of that, and for me that's the relationship with the audience, is to bear witness. 152 00:39:23,380 --> 00:39:30,620 But at the same time, you know, I sense energy coming from people in some performances which are very intimate, 153 00:39:30,620 --> 00:39:36,760 could be a very different setting when it's dark, you know, the the daylight makes a difference. 154 00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:41,230 Sometimes I really come very close and really get into your personal space. 155 00:39:41,230 --> 00:39:48,310 If I feel that the that intimacy, that level of intimacy is what the offering requires for me, 156 00:39:48,310 --> 00:39:57,040 the audience are really integral part of life performance. And as an artist, I describe myself as a multisensory artist. 157 00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:03,550 I like to work on different levels. If I was able to burn incense in here, we would have had incense burning. 158 00:40:03,550 --> 00:40:14,890 You know, the other factor for me is very important. Um, the audience for me provides another canvas on which I can recreate the offering. 159 00:40:14,890 --> 00:40:22,090 And for me as an artist, as a writer, whether I'm painting, whether it's a poem that I'm offering, 160 00:40:22,090 --> 00:40:27,640 I believe the act of creation is not complete until I'm able to engage with an audience, you know, 161 00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:34,360 and it's such a beautiful thing to have a setting like this where, you know, we're able to engage hopefully at some point later on today, 162 00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:38,710 but also have feedback and enter into some kind of dialogue around the piece. 163 00:40:38,710 --> 00:40:47,110 What I'm presenting are provocations that are its future thoughts, its. 164 00:40:47,110 --> 00:40:58,090 For me. Some kind of reverie on some level and to come out of dreamspace and to bring it to human beings who 165 00:40:58,090 --> 00:41:04,060 have beating hearts and emotions and I can read faces and I can sense energy as I'm performing, 166 00:41:04,060 --> 00:41:13,120 takes it into another dimension. Again, it's enrichments. So what you're suggesting is that. 167 00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:23,320 Well, let me rephrase that. Um, just to prove you on this, how much how much do you have a potential audience in mind as you're creating, 168 00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:29,560 as you're rehearsing, as you're sort of workshopping these pieces? 169 00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:40,540 I was conscious in this piece that my poetry is quite dense in the imagery that I use in the just in one verse, you know, there's a lot going on. 170 00:41:40,540 --> 00:41:52,200 And so I created this space. As a kind of opportunity for exhale, just to kind of like ease back a little, 171 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:59,300 although there were still things going on, you know, there was a lot to process and. 172 00:41:59,300 --> 00:42:06,290 I was very conscious as I was choreographing this piece and also the rhythms with the drums, my own body movements, 173 00:42:06,290 --> 00:42:14,000 some of which are improvised, you know, my practise is to always leave space for improvisation. 174 00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:22,650 I always want to be able to have that space to just flow and jump if I want to jump. 175 00:42:22,650 --> 00:42:28,050 So I'm very conscious when I'm crafting a piece that is to be performed when I write. 176 00:42:28,050 --> 00:42:42,400 However, the fidelity to the inspiration for me is paramount and primordial, so I will never censor what comes. 177 00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:48,700 As an artist, again, painting for me is similar, I will offer what comes because for me it's so deep. 178 00:42:48,700 --> 00:42:56,680 It's a relationship between my soul and myself as a vessel to bring this offering to the world. 179 00:42:56,680 --> 00:43:04,490 And so I do not feel it's necessary to. Since sometimes I read back and I might think, oh, 180 00:43:04,490 --> 00:43:10,400 and sometimes words come and they don't make sense to me in the time, but I've just decided when it comes, it comes. 181 00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:16,460 I write it down and I have to trust that that is what it's supposed to be. 182 00:43:16,460 --> 00:43:23,480 OK, well, I mean, I could I could ask you many more questions, but I'd like to open it up to the audience now and please, 183 00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:28,760 do you have any questions for Diane about her process, about the performance? 184 00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:33,410 Because this is such a difficult case, so much gets lost up here. 185 00:43:33,410 --> 00:43:39,410 I'm going to be annoying and and ask you to speak. I thank you, Diane. 186 00:43:39,410 --> 00:43:43,460 I would really looking forward to seeing you. And I finally was able. 187 00:43:43,460 --> 00:43:47,210 Thank you. I wanted to ask about the roses. 188 00:43:47,210 --> 00:43:56,120 I thought that added such an amazing dimension to the to the experience and especially because of what roses do physiologically 189 00:43:56,120 --> 00:44:04,130 and and just the idea of this whole olfactory dimension that one doesn't get with with the great majority of performances. 190 00:44:04,130 --> 00:44:07,670 And that was wonderful. I'm glad you enjoyed it. 191 00:44:07,670 --> 00:44:16,910 Your question you asked me, why did I select the roses? I worked with roses and particularly dead roses. 192 00:44:16,910 --> 00:44:26,050 Um, I do collages with rose petals, and I'm always struck. 193 00:44:26,050 --> 00:44:32,720 By the. Tenacity of the leaves, these are crushed rose petals. 194 00:44:32,720 --> 00:44:38,660 When I work, let's say in class and I'm working with glue, so you've got a rose petal that has dried. 195 00:44:38,660 --> 00:44:43,130 So I will always dry. I love roses just as general. I'll always try them. 196 00:44:43,130 --> 00:44:50,990 And that's that in itself is quite a ritualistic process. I'm a very ritualistic artist, you know, and person just in myself. 197 00:44:50,990 --> 00:44:58,960 And for me, working with rose petals began as a soliloquy on fragility. 198 00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:08,110 And this idea that, yes, you may cut the rose from the garden or buy it fresh cut roses, they will last for a week or however long they last. 199 00:45:08,110 --> 00:45:15,770 And then what happened? And that, to me, speaks of the resilience. 200 00:45:15,770 --> 00:45:28,260 Of. Womanhood. The core themes that I embrace in my work and what I'm presenting in this work first or rhetoric. 201 00:45:28,260 --> 00:45:38,880 Exploring her story somehow. Fragmented from the rhetoric, the grand narratives that encircle us. 202 00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:52,370 The roses for me present and you will have heard in the poetry as well, this is soft, fragile, yet resilient space. 203 00:45:52,370 --> 00:45:59,100 My work is characterised by what I call the three C's communion. 204 00:45:59,100 --> 00:46:06,600 Connexion and cooperation. So for me, for those who did receive the rose petals in their hand, 205 00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:15,680 it was for me an opportunity to connect with you and not perform to you, but to bring you into the space. 206 00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:24,440 So that you also bear witness and you're part of this co creation, that was the inspiration for me. 207 00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:37,370 Thank you. I have another question. Hi, thank you, that was really so not anything I've done before. 208 00:46:37,370 --> 00:46:49,850 You so much. There's a lot of artistic layers here. Did the words always come first or do you sometimes, you know, look at the sculpture and think of, 209 00:46:49,850 --> 00:46:55,490 you know, words that work with the sculpture or the music, does the music sometimes come first? 210 00:46:55,490 --> 00:47:00,350 Is there no specific order? 211 00:47:00,350 --> 00:47:05,270 It's about flow for me. Life is about flow. So you see the never any straight lines in anything that I do. 212 00:47:05,270 --> 00:47:10,970 Um, it's about flow. Often with the poetry, it will. 213 00:47:10,970 --> 00:47:16,640 My writing moments are the most potent for me, and that's generally when I get my flow of poetry. 214 00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:26,720 If I'm this particular series of sculptures came from a residency that I did in Dakar, Senegal, almost three years ago now. 215 00:47:26,720 --> 00:47:33,880 And we were exploring. Women, the family, the free, the liberated woman. 216 00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:43,650 Um, in the context of women migration and development, that's what the core theme of the residency was and, um. 217 00:47:43,650 --> 00:47:48,570 It was through dialogue with other artists, so the whole idea is that we'd have these conversations, we're working. 218 00:47:48,570 --> 00:47:51,460 Everybody had their own particular art, so artistic form. 219 00:47:51,460 --> 00:47:57,900 So I was working with another sculptor who works with iron and metal, for example, and would wake up for whatever time, 220 00:47:57,900 --> 00:48:04,400 you know, artists, you know, ten o'clock they would work through the night either. 221 00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:13,240 And we just start these conversations, which will go on for days and definitely the. 222 00:48:13,240 --> 00:48:21,900 Notes or my contribution or the responses through those dialogues informed these pieces. 223 00:48:21,900 --> 00:48:26,280 Or I might offer a poem and then we start that way. 224 00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,760 So, as I said, there's no strict one, two, three. 225 00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:40,880 It's all about flu for me. Thank you. 226 00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:43,670 OK, thank you very much. That's wonderful. Thank you. 227 00:48:43,670 --> 00:48:50,030 I've got a lot of questions which will probably make themselves very easily, but I just follow on from that one. 228 00:48:50,030 --> 00:48:59,780 I get the point about flow, but there's a point where, you know, your drums playing and the performance have to be put together in some sense. 229 00:48:59,780 --> 00:49:05,330 Um, do you read the text first and then think this is the way to do it? 230 00:49:05,330 --> 00:49:14,720 Or, you know, you want to answer that because it's a very beautifully fitted together. 231 00:49:14,720 --> 00:49:22,800 So if that happens by serendipity, by feeling, as it were, that's a very beautiful thing, but it's a very beautiful thing anyway. 232 00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:32,860 Maybe you had done some routines first and worked out how to do it. 233 00:49:32,860 --> 00:49:45,530 Thank you for that. And we're grateful that you enjoyed it, um, well, it's a relationship between the two of us. 234 00:49:45,530 --> 00:49:52,580 We all come from similar backgrounds, and when I first had to read the poems, 235 00:49:52,580 --> 00:49:59,480 the way the music was constructed was that I asked her to read the poems. 236 00:49:59,480 --> 00:50:09,890 And then here comes the word again. I went with the flow of what the poems were about, and then I get the inspiration to put the drum beat together, 237 00:50:09,890 --> 00:50:14,660 and then we test it out to see whether it actually works with it. 238 00:50:14,660 --> 00:50:23,180 We spent copious amounts of hours to produce this, you know, and there's all sorts of various things going on. 239 00:50:23,180 --> 00:50:32,810 I mean, there's things that could have been, you know, sort of like included in but just time did not permit for that to happen. 240 00:50:32,810 --> 00:50:36,110 So what we do is when we get together, she, you know, 241 00:50:36,110 --> 00:50:45,080 ask her to read me the poems and sometimes I go back and listen to it back and then I get inspired to put it beat the drum beat together, 242 00:50:45,080 --> 00:50:50,360 and then we test it out to see how it works together. Thank you. 243 00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:59,900 Within that, though, there's still, as I said earlier, the space for improvisation and yeah, so so again, for me, it's flow. 244 00:50:59,900 --> 00:51:11,060 Yeah, thank you. And I have another question go for it. 245 00:51:11,060 --> 00:51:16,610 Tell me about your your language use in your poetry. 246 00:51:16,610 --> 00:51:22,670 Tell me what the the the not the meaning of the word, but but using. 247 00:51:22,670 --> 00:51:33,820 What does that mean for you in your poetry? What does it do? So when I say Miss said the three, them say. 248 00:51:33,820 --> 00:51:41,160 And he offers what is that how do you read that? What does it mean for you? 249 00:51:41,160 --> 00:51:55,090 I to ask my mom is sitting there because she knows the three of them say. 250 00:51:55,090 --> 00:52:02,320 So what does it mean for me, Tatsuo? It's part of my makeup. 251 00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:13,100 When people ask me where I'm from being the poet that I am. This is how I respond, I say I am of Caribbean parentage. 252 00:52:13,100 --> 00:52:20,710 Of African heritage and the skin that I gifted in. 253 00:52:20,710 --> 00:52:27,490 Is offered to you. As the Urban Institute. 254 00:52:27,490 --> 00:52:39,690 So for me, that's what it boils down to. Patala, by its very nature, my interpretation is that some kind of up, some kind of melon's. 255 00:52:39,690 --> 00:52:48,740 So my mother is of Jamaican origin, my father is of Vincent and Origin, I spent most of my life in Africa in different parts. 256 00:52:48,740 --> 00:52:59,240 It's a real Mellons going on. There are I never set out to write a poem in patois, but there are some times when the flow, 257 00:52:59,240 --> 00:53:07,490 the emphasis for me is communicated more strongly with a pathway expression. 258 00:53:07,490 --> 00:53:14,660 Those are words that I make up, like the rhetoric. You know, it just came to me was like, actually, yes, that's it. 259 00:53:14,660 --> 00:53:17,660 And when I say the skin that I am gifted in, 260 00:53:17,660 --> 00:53:25,430 I see it as a real gift because a lot of these questions also about identity, you know, and transnational. 261 00:53:25,430 --> 00:53:32,150 Identity expression, living in diaspora spaces and in fact, the reason why it's such a pleasure, 262 00:53:32,150 --> 00:53:38,810 thank you, Erica and Erica, for including me in this project is that we're exploring British writing. 263 00:53:38,810 --> 00:53:44,780 So for me, that was a bit of a, oh, OK. Is my writing British? 264 00:53:44,780 --> 00:53:53,870 For a long time in my life, I rejected that notion that I could be a British writer, but evidently it's a part of me. 265 00:53:53,870 --> 00:54:03,410 And so the reason why I constructed the poem to respond to anybody who asked me where I was from, if I said I'm born in Oxford, which I was. 266 00:54:03,410 --> 00:54:05,540 You know, when people ask that question, I mean, so many things, 267 00:54:05,540 --> 00:54:10,700 but it became quite a sore point for me at some point in my life because I found that people just wanted to catch you. 268 00:54:10,700 --> 00:54:15,380 Oh, you're born in Oxford. OK, good. And I just did not tell my story at all. 269 00:54:15,380 --> 00:54:24,240 So this question of indigeneity and the fact that I believe we all have the opportunity to construct. 270 00:54:24,240 --> 00:54:27,630 This sense of what it means to belong, to be indigenous, 271 00:54:27,630 --> 00:54:34,920 to be a part of a society culturally through my cultural expression, is really a core part of my offering. 272 00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:38,460 Whatever my work, I had to come to a place in my own life. 273 00:54:38,460 --> 00:54:46,090 I always work from an embodied space. You my own experiences. I had to come to a point in my own life where. 274 00:54:46,090 --> 00:54:51,050 My cultural expression I had to put front and centre. 275 00:54:51,050 --> 00:54:59,690 So as opposed to wanting to assimilate to I have to just accept and recognise and actually embrace when I was able to embrace it and say, 276 00:54:59,690 --> 00:55:04,520 you are this melon's of all these different cultures, I saw it as a gift. 277 00:55:04,520 --> 00:55:06,650 And that is how I offer, you know, 278 00:55:06,650 --> 00:55:15,440 everything from head to toe that I am and where I am able to present my works and share them as offerings for that conversation to happen. 279 00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:22,020 You know, because in this world where the other. 280 00:55:22,020 --> 00:55:29,630 Seems to be such a pertinent discussion and it's causing so much strife and war and pain. 281 00:55:29,630 --> 00:55:40,690 Today, this question of the other. I believe is such a rich tapestry. 282 00:55:40,690 --> 00:55:48,460 That we can all contribute to and be part of. So a core part of my offering, whatever it is, is to say, come, let's weave together you, 283 00:55:48,460 --> 00:55:52,280 bring yours, I bring mine, and let's see what things we can create. 284 00:55:52,280 --> 00:55:56,530 And it doesn't always have to be beautiful. I mean, I dwell in beauty. That's true. 285 00:55:56,530 --> 00:56:00,980 Um, it's very difficult for me to write poems about pain and torture. 286 00:56:00,980 --> 00:56:05,950 That's just not the place I sit in. Um, if it comes. 287 00:56:05,950 --> 00:56:11,170 Fair enough. But to date, that's just not the Speyside. Well, you know, I see myself as a Jurema. 288 00:56:11,170 --> 00:56:15,130 I see myself as a realist. 289 00:56:15,130 --> 00:56:23,510 Um, it's not a utopian situation for me at all, I have seen and I've experienced that when I bring the core of myself forward. 290 00:56:23,510 --> 00:56:30,390 Generally, I can find a connexion with others. On some level, in some way. 291 00:56:30,390 --> 00:56:47,790 And from there, we can build. Do we have any more questions? 292 00:56:47,790 --> 00:56:56,610 I'm very curious about your sculptures. They're so symbolic, I find, and I can I have my own imaginations and things, 293 00:56:56,610 --> 00:57:01,800 they could be which I have, which probably all of us have in a way and have different ideas. 294 00:57:01,800 --> 00:57:12,450 But could you say a bit more about that or do you want that to remind you asking what is the very substantive question to explain their work? 295 00:57:12,450 --> 00:57:17,110 Um, I'd be interested to hear maybe how you're receiving them. 296 00:57:17,110 --> 00:57:22,250 What is your imagination around these? Um. 297 00:57:22,250 --> 00:57:30,660 Well, I've been I've just recently been to New Zealand, there's a stretch on a beach in New Zealand where you have stones and this form. 298 00:57:30,660 --> 00:57:39,210 And Mauriac, they're called the Mauriac Borders, and they're a bit bigger than this, and the Maremmas, they were baskets. 299 00:57:39,210 --> 00:57:46,520 So baskets that the First Fleet or the first not the first fleet, the the the Maori who first came to New Zealand brought. 300 00:57:46,520 --> 00:57:54,870 So I was thinking of basket's you were talking about gifts, um, exchanges of things. 301 00:57:54,870 --> 00:58:00,570 But it's also I like the round form but also that it's unfinished anyway. 302 00:58:00,570 --> 00:58:06,890 I love the colours. Thank you. 303 00:58:06,890 --> 00:58:17,730 I'd love to hear some others. I wasn't I wasn't sure I was hearing you quite well, so I might be repeating what you said, but to me, 304 00:58:17,730 --> 00:58:25,650 they symbolise birth because of those creatures that are, I assume, crawling out of the cracked egg. 305 00:58:25,650 --> 00:58:31,830 Wow. Beautiful. Thank you. I was thinking myself of seeds of the coconuts. 306 00:58:31,830 --> 00:58:38,790 You know, it floats great distances over the ocean and then germinates its plants on distant shores. 307 00:58:38,790 --> 00:58:47,630 Mm. You know, I was thinking something very similar about the eggs, but also kind of in a sort of process of growth. 308 00:58:47,630 --> 00:58:52,040 You've got these things coming off and you talking about fecundity and fertility. 309 00:58:52,040 --> 00:59:09,710 And, yeah, it was really like, thank you. I also want to go with Terrance's do you reading. 310 00:59:09,710 --> 00:59:19,790 OK, I just wanted to say that for me, the husks through, you know, we talked about fruit seeds, but the both ends of that cycle. 311 00:59:19,790 --> 00:59:25,360 And when you put one on your head, it became a kind of scowl. 312 00:59:25,360 --> 00:59:33,420 A sign of. Honeymoon period aside, so we can do a lot of things with that shape. 313 00:59:33,420 --> 00:59:39,710 It's very fluid and I think fluidity as well as flow is part of the way you. 314 00:59:39,710 --> 00:59:48,600 So if you take a defined shape that has some possibilities but not infinite possibilities, and then you fly with that. 315 00:59:48,600 --> 00:59:53,630 I love this. See, this is the beauty of having this kind of dialogue space. 316 00:59:53,630 --> 00:59:59,660 I often as a consumer, let's say I go to excuse me and say I go to the theatre, 317 00:59:59,660 --> 01:00:05,090 etc. I often want to speak with the person who wrote the play or some of the actors, 318 01:00:05,090 --> 01:00:12,080 etc. So it's a really beautiful space that's being created and it's lovely, always wonderful to be able to hear how people perceive the work. 319 01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:17,630 I intentionally presented this as unfinished works and I could equally decide that they are finished, 320 01:00:17,630 --> 01:00:24,890 you know, um, but for me, I created them as unfinished works because I see this as a journey. 321 01:00:24,890 --> 01:00:30,550 So three years ago, I created these. I haven't done much too much with them. 322 01:00:30,550 --> 01:00:39,630 I've since that time, some of them have had some additional wire pieces put on the edges, for example, here. 323 01:00:39,630 --> 01:00:44,320 They all have things of seven themes I work in with numbers, I work with seven, 324 01:00:44,320 --> 01:00:51,080 and generally I work with one, three or seven with everything that I do. 325 01:00:51,080 --> 01:01:02,520 For various reasons, they each have a theme. I want to leave your images in your imagination and let it unfold in your subconscious as you leave here, 326 01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:09,390 but I'll just say that the inspiration for this collection is part of a bigger work called the Venus Sensorium. 327 01:01:09,390 --> 01:01:19,350 And this is where I'm exploring. It's a five year exploration for me, where I'm exploring love as a spiritual practise. 328 01:01:19,350 --> 01:01:36,410 And so this is one movement in that work. I'm just thinking how much more I should say I. 329 01:01:36,410 --> 01:01:43,790 Was inspired to. Come to this work. 330 01:01:43,790 --> 01:01:53,090 When I heard how many women I was watching some programme randomly very late, many years ago, um. 331 01:01:53,090 --> 01:02:02,250 The programme fussin. And I think it was this fashion, somebody living in South Africa. 332 01:02:02,250 --> 01:02:08,170 Yes, I was living in South Africa at the time and I had BBC something on whatever and. 333 01:02:08,170 --> 01:02:12,710 There was a time when he goes on the streets and interviews people, all these vox pops. 334 01:02:12,710 --> 01:02:19,930 And he was asking women which part of themselves they disliked the most. 335 01:02:19,930 --> 01:02:30,310 And it shocked me. When every person, every woman who was speaking to women said mycetoma, every single one of them. 336 01:02:30,310 --> 01:02:38,680 And I found the. Traumatising. 337 01:02:38,680 --> 01:02:46,490 This was every woman, every shape, every size you can imagine. Everyone said, oh, I hate that we're using such extreme language. 338 01:02:46,490 --> 01:02:52,130 And that inspired me at that point to explore, you know, what is this how could we be so in a collective sense, 339 01:02:52,130 --> 01:02:59,060 so dislocated and so cut off from our centre of creation, our fecundity? 340 01:02:59,060 --> 01:03:04,460 And that really sparked off. I mean, that had to be more than five years ago, I'd say close to 10. 341 01:03:04,460 --> 01:03:14,780 And that's part of this idea of love as a spiritual practise. And, you know, my focus on women and explorations of. 342 01:03:14,780 --> 01:03:21,800 A reshaping of reimagining. So what I'm proposing here, can we reimagine? 343 01:03:21,800 --> 01:03:29,690 Ourselves within the narrative and maybe external to the narrative, as we gaze at the grand narratives of what it is to be a woman. 344 01:03:29,690 --> 01:03:37,470 This is also interlinked with my my work as a healer. You know, I spent many years in different parts of Africa. 345 01:03:37,470 --> 01:03:49,000 It was almost like an initiation process where I sat with grandmothers, I sat with women in villages, in communities who are tasked with. 346 01:03:49,000 --> 01:03:55,420 Cultivating a sense of femininity. Amongst school children. 347 01:03:55,420 --> 01:04:02,100 Through rites of passage, and so a lot of my work is also concerning rites of passage and, um. 348 01:04:02,100 --> 01:04:10,360 They would always speak to me about this innate power that sits within women and men. 349 01:04:10,360 --> 01:04:16,800 And it was such a different perspective. It thrilled me. 350 01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:21,540 It opened up this Fecundity River for me, you know, and I floated it ever since. 351 01:04:21,540 --> 01:04:26,030 And, you know, I really see myself as an emissary to bring this kind of. 352 01:04:26,030 --> 01:04:32,060 Work forward and this narrative, so I will explain exactly what each piece means and this work is still unfolding. 353 01:04:32,060 --> 01:04:37,340 So I aim to take this to a residency again and really spend a month just working on it. 354 01:04:37,340 --> 01:04:42,890 And everything that I'm hearing from you and other audiences where I will share this work, I'll put back into it. 355 01:04:42,890 --> 01:04:47,540 So, again, it's this constant process, you know, beginning in the end, as you spoke about. 356 01:04:47,540 --> 01:04:52,190 Yes. That they will never finish. Maybe they will. 357 01:04:52,190 --> 01:04:56,220 But for me from now, I was really interested in leaving them. 358 01:04:56,220 --> 01:05:02,140 Quite not quite pristinely finish for me, it's not ever going to be a pristine finish work, 359 01:05:02,140 --> 01:05:06,450 um, but they may be mounted differently the next time you see them. 360 01:05:06,450 --> 01:05:11,840 You know, we'll see where we. 361 01:05:11,840 --> 01:05:23,990 Can I just say you haven't said anything about the wearable art, sorry, I'm in the middle of something else, the same question again. 362 01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:27,950 Are you purposefully avoiding talking about that or is it. 363 01:05:27,950 --> 01:05:32,240 I'm an abstract artist, as you may have seen. I'm a conceptual artist. 364 01:05:32,240 --> 01:05:36,950 Um, how did you read it? What did it symbolise for you? 365 01:05:36,950 --> 01:05:43,440 Well, the obvious thing to me was. But that was sort of as far as they got. 366 01:05:43,440 --> 01:05:54,030 Yeah, I think for me it's that it was like it's between an umbilical cord and the skin that you shed. 367 01:05:54,030 --> 01:06:01,820 So there are times when it's the skin, but the core of it is an umbilical cord. Yes, indeed. 368 01:06:01,820 --> 01:06:08,900 I understood it as a snake, and I saw in it a snake charmer or using it a snake charmer. 369 01:06:08,900 --> 01:06:16,190 I love that. I love that serpents are very present in my work. 370 01:06:16,190 --> 01:06:22,900 Yes. Oh, it's definitely a choice, surely that's I'm not sure the material is, 371 01:06:22,900 --> 01:06:27,850 but it's the last, at least in some ways, that it's it has some sort of inattention. 372 01:06:27,850 --> 01:06:31,810 It's not flopping down flat on the ground now that it's so. 373 01:06:31,810 --> 01:06:36,850 You said it's definitely inattention in the rovers. We can see the way that it's coiled now. 374 01:06:36,850 --> 01:06:41,020 And how did you read it for? What was it for you? 375 01:06:41,020 --> 01:06:49,330 I'm not sure, but that's definitely, I think, probably key to its dynamic within the dance that, yes, it has that property. 376 01:06:49,330 --> 01:07:02,820 Oh, thank. I think things are extensions of your. 377 01:07:02,820 --> 01:07:11,210 That's you and objects they become. The instrument by which he express. 378 01:07:11,210 --> 01:07:21,290 Thus, they anticipate. Snake oil is fine, but don't do that because you do do with your body and. 379 01:07:21,290 --> 01:07:31,720 Absolutely. You've got it in one. And I think that that is the opportunity for all of us, you know, to this kind of corporate expression. 380 01:07:31,720 --> 01:07:35,520 This is very key in my work. Um. 381 01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:44,940 But really bring ourselves front and centre to questions we're pondering or situations we're encountering, you know, really bringing ourselves and. 382 01:07:44,940 --> 01:07:54,150 Placing ourselves centre, front and centre into whatever it is we're exploring, I feel that the. 383 01:07:54,150 --> 01:07:57,180 Kind of like peering in at the edge, you know, for me, 384 01:07:57,180 --> 01:08:04,380 there is a time when I actually look into them because they all represent different worlds and they all have their own story so that, 385 01:08:04,380 --> 01:08:08,520 you know, there's a possibility and they will have a series of poems for each one as well. 386 01:08:08,520 --> 01:08:14,550 I didn't choose one poem, you know, which would mean quite a didactic approach to it, which is not how I work, 387 01:08:14,550 --> 01:08:21,990 but I feel that we're in a time where there is a requirement, there is a responsibility. 388 01:08:21,990 --> 01:08:27,900 I feel for us to really stand front and centre with what we believe, you know, really deep conviction. 389 01:08:27,900 --> 01:08:40,300 So that's also part of the invitation. Yeah. You know, we've been working together for about a year now. 390 01:08:40,300 --> 01:08:50,440 And when you talk about The Matrix, for me, that's the part that is of sort of most poignant with regards to the whole world, 391 01:08:50,440 --> 01:08:58,430 because that's one of the things, the stories she told me of when you went around the world, especially in Africa and you sat with The Matrix. 392 01:08:58,430 --> 01:09:06,940 And it's like the handing down of, you know, uh, generational, generational, um, 393 01:09:06,940 --> 01:09:14,740 characteristics and attributes that are taught that doesn't exist in today's society, which I believe is missing. 394 01:09:14,740 --> 01:09:21,220 Can you sort of, like, expand a little bit on that on why I went with me? 395 01:09:21,220 --> 01:09:30,160 Yeah, because I don't know if people realise, but the last part was when The Matrix, you know, that very symbolic. 396 01:09:30,160 --> 01:09:40,550 But as I understand it, I don't want to take that much away, but I feel it's quite important for people to leave here. 397 01:09:40,550 --> 01:09:46,570 Hmm. Understanding, because that is the history of how this came about. 398 01:09:46,570 --> 01:09:58,520 You know. Lobaton in Mandinka culture stretching across Mali, Senegal and Guinea is a, quote, inspiration for this. 399 01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:06,120 So this sculpture piece. When I was creating it, you know, they work inside as well. 400 01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:16,130 They also have places, you know, and things happening inside and also almost people's. 401 01:10:16,130 --> 01:10:22,910 But I really saw this as a crown, and this is part of the teachings. 402 01:10:22,910 --> 01:10:26,720 Step into your power, step into your greatness, wear your crown. 403 01:10:26,720 --> 01:10:31,880 These are threats of some of the poems that I was reading for you. 404 01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:39,700 For me, the matriarchal wisdom, the African perspectives that I was so blessed and privileged to be. 405 01:10:39,700 --> 01:10:46,660 Initiated into, trained in and at some point to accept as part of my work, 406 01:10:46,660 --> 01:10:54,040 I see myself as a matriarchal emissary to bring this because I see how powerful these perspectives are. 407 01:10:54,040 --> 01:11:00,010 And it's not that they're missing. I feel well, it's not that they are something that we don't know. 408 01:11:00,010 --> 01:11:02,200 Perspective's. 409 01:11:02,200 --> 01:11:13,670 You know, the goddess wear your crown queen is a very popular thing right now, is is out there in the world, is out there and literature. 410 01:11:13,670 --> 01:11:21,170 The. Opportunity to explore my. 411 01:11:21,170 --> 01:11:29,640 Innate feminine power through rites of passage is what the pageant teach and. 412 01:11:29,640 --> 01:11:35,640 The inspiration for me to always recall the matriarchs comes from something that I 413 01:11:35,640 --> 01:11:39,780 shared with you in the very beginning of which was no matter where I was sitting, 414 01:11:39,780 --> 01:11:45,550 would it be in Ethiopia? In Senegal? I sat in southern Africa, different parts of southern Africa. 415 01:11:45,550 --> 01:11:49,530 I would literally be at the grandmothers knees, literally sitting. 416 01:11:49,530 --> 01:11:59,640 And they would always say very early on in the conversation, because often I would ask somebody to find this grandmother or this, 417 01:11:59,640 --> 01:12:06,380 you know, these women who I later, for me was important to elevate their status to matriarchs. 418 01:12:06,380 --> 01:12:13,610 They don't carry official titles are known as the Aunties in the Village. Oh, Johnny or you know, Josephine is coming to puberty. 419 01:12:13,610 --> 01:12:17,060 Time to take it to the auntie so she can tell them about menstruation. 420 01:12:17,060 --> 01:12:21,980 And, you know, it's the kind of role that the aunties play in the village and the community. 421 01:12:21,980 --> 01:12:28,280 And they would always say, my child. Thank you for remembering us. 422 01:12:28,280 --> 01:12:34,140 There was definitely this sense of, uh, um, want a secret society, you know, a lot of. 423 01:12:34,140 --> 01:12:40,110 Thought they were secret, you could go in there, know men also had their initiation processes, but. 424 01:12:40,110 --> 01:12:50,400 The sense of it being lost, the sense of this is a dwindling and somehow very valuable but not appreciated way of seeing the world. 425 01:12:50,400 --> 01:12:57,650 And so for me, um. When I say the matriarchs, them say I use it a lot when I'm posting on social media. 426 01:12:57,650 --> 01:13:05,210 It's really just to bring this consciousness around, you know, that we have ancient wisdom. 427 01:13:05,210 --> 01:13:09,500 We have indigenous stories. I see them as anchors. 428 01:13:09,500 --> 01:13:11,060 I see them as footholds. 429 01:13:11,060 --> 01:13:26,420 And I see our being in this context and in this day and my work as an opportunity to anchor myself in those traditions and then to see my own gaze. 430 01:13:26,420 --> 01:13:34,590 My life experience, my desires as an opportunity to transmit, transform, to offer and share. 431 01:13:34,590 --> 01:13:40,160 So I'm happy that I'm an artist so that I can do this.