1 00:00:17,020 --> 00:00:24,040 So hopefully, you can see the slides there, managing stress and overcoming anxiety. 2 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:32,530 And just one point, if we could just make sure that our microphones are muted while we're speaking, this won't just help the talk, to be very clear. 3 00:00:32,530 --> 00:00:37,150 So just to begin again, I'd like to thank Cathy and Howie for inviting this talk. 4 00:00:37,150 --> 00:00:45,860 It's obviously very timely given the current circumstances. And it's true, I am a trauma expert specialising in post-traumatic stress disorder. 5 00:00:45,860 --> 00:00:52,580 But what can trauma and extreme stress teach us about coping with everyday life, about overcoming anxiety? 6 00:00:52,580 --> 00:00:57,710 As a psychologist, I specialise in helping people to overcome post-traumatic stress disorder. 7 00:00:57,710 --> 00:01:03,560 So this is the crippling stress reaction that afflicts soldiers and other survivors of terrible events. 8 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:08,330 As a scientist, I develop and test strategies to prevent PTSD. 9 00:01:08,330 --> 00:01:16,190 I have built programmes based on the latest science to improve resilience for people in the most stressful and dangerous jobs as police officers, 10 00:01:16,190 --> 00:01:24,780 firefighters, paramedics and now ICU workers. In my 20 years of practise, I've noticed something remarkable. 11 00:01:24,780 --> 00:01:32,900 The tools that transform anxiety and stress are the same tools that support people to achieve extraordinary success. 12 00:01:32,900 --> 00:01:37,040 In this talk, I'm going to give you a snapshot of the seven tools that you can better manage 13 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:46,310 the anxiety and stress in your own life to support you on your path to success. 14 00:01:46,310 --> 00:01:52,940 So the first rule is to focus on facts, not feelings, to deal with worry. 15 00:01:52,940 --> 00:01:57,140 Science shows that 88 percent of our worries never come true. 16 00:01:57,140 --> 00:02:01,820 One of the best ways to discover this is to keep a worry diary for a week. 17 00:02:01,820 --> 00:02:05,600 Note your worry and then the outcome and tally it. 18 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:09,260 How many worries did you have? How many came true? 19 00:02:09,260 --> 00:02:15,200 You'll likely discover that your worries come true much less often than you feel they will, which is good news. 20 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:20,240 It means that you when you spot your worrying, you can remind yourself of a reassuring fact. 21 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:29,270 Most of your worries don't come true. Research shows that the best thing to do when you spot your worrying is to disengage from it. 22 00:02:29,270 --> 00:02:31,160 How do you disengage from worry? 23 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:40,640 A study carried out at King's in London found that people picturing the likely outcome to your worry that is an outcome based on facts, not feelings, 24 00:02:40,640 --> 00:02:48,710 and of you coping no matter what comes your way or picturing any positive image such as sunshine helped people to disengage from worry. 25 00:02:48,710 --> 00:02:52,280 It led to decreases in anxiety and worry. 26 00:02:52,280 --> 00:03:01,580 The team at King's trained people who had uncontrollable worry to practise replacing their worry with images of possible positive outcomes, 27 00:03:01,580 --> 00:03:05,930 or they trained them to talk through possible positive outcomes using words, 28 00:03:05,930 --> 00:03:12,110 not pictures in their mind's eye, or to picture positive images unrelated to their worries. 29 00:03:12,110 --> 00:03:18,590 Everyone in the study benefited from reductions in anxiety and distress and sustained base improvements one month later. 30 00:03:18,590 --> 00:03:21,470 So what this means is that when you spot your worrying, 31 00:03:21,470 --> 00:03:34,060 use this as a cue to picture a possible likely outcome to your worry or even a positive image like sunshine, you'll feel less anxious as a result. 32 00:03:34,060 --> 00:03:42,400 The next tool is to to tap practical thinking that's what I call practical thinking, to overcome overthinking. 33 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:43,310 Everyone does it. 34 00:03:43,310 --> 00:03:50,650 We chew over the past from time to time, and when we're dwelling are mood will plummet and unhappy memories are more likely to surface, 35 00:03:50,650 --> 00:03:53,170 which keeps us focussed on unhappy thoughts. 36 00:03:53,170 --> 00:04:00,520 It's a vicious cycle leading to poor problem solving, more unhappy feelings and in challenging times, more severe stress. 37 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:05,530 Imagine this You wake up early on Monday morning and you get ready for an important meeting. 38 00:04:05,530 --> 00:04:10,690 You're chairing on Zoom at nine a.m. You switch on your laptop and the screen is black. 39 00:04:10,690 --> 00:04:14,230 It doesn't start across the on and off button again and again. 40 00:04:14,230 --> 00:04:19,270 It doesn't start. Oh, what's going on? Thoughts raced through your mind. 41 00:04:19,270 --> 00:04:23,380 Why won't my laptop start? Why is this happening today of all days? 42 00:04:23,380 --> 00:04:28,990 Why don't I start any problems with it last night? What are problems like this always happen to me? 43 00:04:28,990 --> 00:04:34,950 Imagine this is happening to you. How might you be feeling? 44 00:04:34,950 --> 00:04:41,160 Now, imagine the same scenario again, and this time you think, how can I best deal with this? 45 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:44,200 How can I chair the meeting at nine am? 46 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:51,010 And the first scenario with Y thoughts swelling your mind, you'll be more inclined to run back to bed and pull the duvet over your head. 47 00:04:51,010 --> 00:04:56,200 And the second scenario how thoughts guide, problem solving and decision making. 48 00:04:56,200 --> 00:05:00,910 They'll be able to find a solution, such as suggesting to chair the meeting over your mobile. 49 00:05:00,910 --> 00:05:07,810 So dwelling as an unproductive pattern of thinking, the more you do it, the more you strengthen the neural pathways in your brain, 50 00:05:07,810 --> 00:05:12,490 making it the default modes of thinking when you encounter disappointment or stress. 51 00:05:12,490 --> 00:05:19,090 Dwelling keeps depression going, and it increases anxiety. So spot when your thoughts have turned to why and what if? 52 00:05:19,090 --> 00:05:25,300 And instead of spending energy trying to answer unanswerable questions, ask How can I feel better now? 53 00:05:25,300 --> 00:05:32,080 How can I refocus to the task at hand? Then take the step that will help to boost you or your focus? 54 00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:34,990 You could hit the treadmill circuits class or if that's not possible, 55 00:05:34,990 --> 00:05:39,400 try a bout of jumping jacks or even bringing a friend to ask what is new and good with them? 56 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:46,360 All helpful strategies to get out of your head. Suddenly, the whys and what ifs will feel less important because you're giving them less 57 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:54,840 attention and absorbing yourself in an activity that needs your full attention. 58 00:05:54,840 --> 00:06:01,890 So the next tool is to use then versus now to break the link with past events that fuel self-doubt 59 00:06:01,890 --> 00:06:06,570 then versus now is a trauma treatment tool that helps to unhook the present from the past. 60 00:06:06,570 --> 00:06:13,290 By helping you to focus on how now is different to men, rather than focussing on how the situations may be similar. 61 00:06:13,290 --> 00:06:17,970 For example, if you've spoken up in a meeting and had a flat response next time, 62 00:06:17,970 --> 00:06:23,070 focus on how different the new environment is to the past, not how similar it is. 63 00:06:23,070 --> 00:06:29,910 Perhaps they're a different team members in the meeting room. Your slides are different. Notice how keen people look to hear what you have to say. 64 00:06:29,910 --> 00:06:38,700 Focus on the many ways now is different to them. Focussing on what you can see and hear in the here and now keeps you rooted in the present 65 00:06:38,700 --> 00:06:42,990 and gets your attention out of your head and away from feelings and memories of self-doubt. 66 00:06:42,990 --> 00:06:51,220 It keeps you absorbed in the task at hand, which is where you need to be to manage anxiety and stress. 67 00:06:51,220 --> 00:06:56,530 The next tool to manage anxiety and stress is to plan ahead. 68 00:06:56,530 --> 00:07:00,730 This is a really important tool and very important for the current times. 69 00:07:00,730 --> 00:07:05,560 There is science to planning ahead. Several studies that have come out of our lab show that making a plan in the 70 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:10,480 evening for the next day and including one enjoyable activity in your plan, 71 00:07:10,480 --> 00:07:15,880 dramatically improves mood, well-being and productivity and reduces anxiety. 72 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:20,800 Plan your work day and a half hour chunks and use the plan as a schedule to guide you. 73 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:23,140 Revamping and recreating it through the day, 74 00:07:23,140 --> 00:07:28,390 especially when you discover that you've wildly underestimated how long it takes to reply to those emails. 75 00:07:28,390 --> 00:07:32,120 We write that code or write up your project results. 76 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:38,870 Planning ahead works to reduce anxiety and stress because it moves routine decision making to the night before, 77 00:07:38,870 --> 00:07:43,760 which frees up mental energy to tackle challenging tasks the following day. 78 00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:49,160 Having a detailed plan makes you more productive and you'll be more likely to reach your goals and of course, 79 00:07:49,160 --> 00:08:00,130 including a fun activity even for a few minutes. And your plan makes it more likely that you'll do something fun, which increases well-being. 80 00:08:00,130 --> 00:08:09,500 The next tool is to use the three minute carrot. The three minute care is helpful to overcome avoidance, avoidance keeps anxiety going. 81 00:08:09,500 --> 00:08:14,450 There's no other outcome with avoidance. Achieving a more centred life means kicking avoidance. 82 00:08:14,450 --> 00:08:18,770 It means choosing what is best for you rather than what is easiest when common 83 00:08:18,770 --> 00:08:23,240 behaviour amongst students and staff is procrastination putting off for tomorrow? 84 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:30,050 What would be best to get done today? If you're struggling to get started with something, you're avoiding use of three minute carrots. 85 00:08:30,050 --> 00:08:35,570 Give yourself permission to try the new behaviour for just three minutes, then reassess how you're feeling. 86 00:08:35,570 --> 00:08:40,760 Giving yourself permission to carry on for another three minutes. If you choose to order, stop. 87 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:46,010 You can also break the first step into tiny steps and take the first tiny step to start. 88 00:08:46,010 --> 00:08:50,480 It's manageable to complete a small step like write an outline for my essay or 89 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:54,440 grants application before the bigger step right in the background section. 90 00:08:54,440 --> 00:09:01,360 Completing the small step gives a sense of a sense of achievement and a breath of success to motivate next steps. 91 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:09,400 And after the first step, get cosy with smart language to resist temptations, to give back into avoidance, which will increase anxiety. 92 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:14,290 So use the words I don't rather than I can't when tempted away from your goals. 93 00:09:14,290 --> 00:09:20,890 Studies suggest that if you say I can't, you'll be more likely to give in to temptation and give up the goal your plan to work towards. 94 00:09:20,890 --> 00:09:27,190 But if when you're faced with temptation, you use the words I don't, you'll be much more inclined to follow through with your goals. 95 00:09:27,190 --> 00:09:32,830 So if when a mate asks you to have a drink over Zoom, you respond with, I don't drink on Tuesdays. 96 00:09:32,830 --> 00:09:36,430 You'll be much more likely to follow through with the original goal you had planned for the evening, 97 00:09:36,430 --> 00:09:41,860 which might have been writing that essay or working on that application. Why is that? 98 00:09:41,860 --> 00:09:50,120 Using the words I don't in response to temptations increases your sense of empowerment with goals making you more likely to work towards them. 99 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:57,230 Another tool to help you over the start line is to make decisions based on how you want to feel, not in how you're actually feeling. 100 00:09:57,230 --> 00:10:03,110 Most people make decisions based on how they're feeling in the moment rather than on how they want to feel in the future. 101 00:10:03,110 --> 00:10:10,220 So one of the ways to overcome avoidance and reduce anxiety is to consider how you want to feel in the future and to be guided by this today. 102 00:10:10,220 --> 00:10:17,030 So if exercising will make you feel energised and happy. We're finishing up an admin task will make you feel relieved and rewarded. 103 00:10:17,030 --> 00:10:26,210 Make your decision to get started based on how you know it will make you feel rather than how you're already feeling. 104 00:10:26,210 --> 00:10:33,620 The next important tool is focus. It absolutely matters what you focus on and how you focus, 105 00:10:33,620 --> 00:10:40,250 people who manage stress well choose to focus on what they can do rather than what they can't. 106 00:10:40,250 --> 00:10:45,600 They realise they don't have endless years to bring their goals into reality, so they optimise their time. 107 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:50,870 And one of the ways they do this is learning to focus efficiently without distraction. 108 00:10:50,870 --> 00:10:54,230 There are two types of focus helpful and unhelpful. 109 00:10:54,230 --> 00:11:02,850 Unhelpful attention is focussed that's gone inside ourselves to our thoughts, our feelings, our fears or sensations in our body like our heart rate. 110 00:11:02,850 --> 00:11:06,720 And unhelpful focus will always raise anxiety and increased stress. 111 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:14,250 For example, if I was worried about sweating and I focussed all of my attention on my forehead here as if I had sweat patches, 112 00:11:14,250 --> 00:11:22,750 I'd soon lose my train of thought and I'd be working hard to cover up my sweat patches like this and possibly looking away. 113 00:11:22,750 --> 00:11:29,050 Which were draw more rather than less attention to me and what might be quite distracted, helpful attention, on the other hand, 114 00:11:29,050 --> 00:11:34,990 which is also called externally focussed attention, is the kind of attention that's out of our heads and in the world. 115 00:11:34,990 --> 00:11:42,070 So ignoring my fake sweat patches and focussing on our talk will make me feel more at ease and less anxious. 116 00:11:42,070 --> 00:11:47,410 Even though you can see that I've, I had poured water on my forehead. 117 00:11:47,410 --> 00:11:50,530 People are most satisfied when they're absorbed in the task at hand, 118 00:11:50,530 --> 00:12:00,600 particularly when they're absorbed in something that is challenging enough to be stimulating, but not so challenging that it is frustrating. 119 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:06,390 And finally, possibly the most important tool for dealing with anxiety and stress, 120 00:12:06,390 --> 00:12:10,020 certainly for dealing with stress, is to extend the compassion you extend to others, 121 00:12:10,020 --> 00:12:17,880 to yourself, speaking to yourself with kindness, lower stress hormones and makes you more optimistic as well as a better problem solver. 122 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:23,850 Whereas self-critical talk zaps motivation. In a study of almost 200 students, 123 00:12:23,850 --> 00:12:27,330 Kristin Neff and her team looked at different aspects of having compassion for 124 00:12:27,330 --> 00:12:32,820 oneself that self-compassion and its links with positive emotions and qualities. 125 00:12:32,820 --> 00:12:38,910 Self-compassion is that capacity to extend kindness towards ourselves in instances of pain or failure, 126 00:12:38,910 --> 00:12:44,250 the capacity to normalise our difficult experiences by recognising that people around the world have similar 127 00:12:44,250 --> 00:12:51,060 struggles and that our struggles are part of the larger human experience as we're learning with coronavirus. 128 00:12:51,060 --> 00:12:57,200 It's also the capacity to see painful thoughts and feelings as passing rather than identifying with them. 129 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:01,280 Neff and her team discovered that self-compassion was linked to happiness, optimism, 130 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:09,830 positive emotions and qualities such as wisdom, personal initiative, curiosity, agreeableness, extroversion and conscientiousness, 131 00:13:09,830 --> 00:13:17,660 her team concluded that self-compassion may give rise to happiness and feelings of calm because it creates feelings of warmth, 132 00:13:17,660 --> 00:13:21,730 connexion with others and a sense of balance or equilibrium. 133 00:13:21,730 --> 00:13:29,560 When we're happy, we're less likely to ruminate or dwell about the past or worry about the future, which is linked to anxiety and depression, 134 00:13:29,560 --> 00:13:36,220 a self compassionate mindset is linked to adaptive coping skills and could keep people feeling optimistic about the future. 135 00:13:36,220 --> 00:13:41,530 Feelings of compassion for oneself and others is linked to greater activation of the left prefrontal cortex, 136 00:13:41,530 --> 00:13:44,600 the part of the brain linked to joy and optimism. 137 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:51,680 If you're struggling to speak to yourself with kindness, you could first try to think kind thoughts or carry out kind gestures for other people. 138 00:13:51,680 --> 00:14:01,290 The act of being kind will boost your mood and put you in a frame of mind where it's easier for you to be kind to yourself. 139 00:14:01,290 --> 00:14:05,820 So just to wrap up, everyone feels anxious and stressed from time to time. 140 00:14:05,820 --> 00:14:13,170 There are tools to help these times become less frequent. So you can progress your path to success without feeling so overwhelmed. 141 00:14:13,170 --> 00:14:17,040 Remember facts, not feelings to overcome worry? 142 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:25,700 Use a worry diary and in the midst of worrying picture of possible positive outcome to the worry or any positive, uplifting image. 143 00:14:25,700 --> 00:14:30,800 The next to the second tool was practical thinking it's not overthinking. 144 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:35,580 Dwelling is your cue to get out of your head and thought, how to move forward. 145 00:14:35,580 --> 00:14:45,410 The third tool then versus now helps to break the link to the past, unhooking the present from past events that fuelled self-doubt or anxiety. 146 00:14:45,410 --> 00:14:56,530 Plan ahead, break your days into half hour chunks and assign your tasks really important and include a fun activity, even if brief in your plan. 147 00:14:56,530 --> 00:15:05,230 Kick avoidance start, a new behaviour with a tiny step. Make decisions based on how you want to feel, not in how you're actually feeling. 148 00:15:05,230 --> 00:15:13,860 Use a three minute carrot to get started with big deadlines. And remember, I don't vs. I can't to resist temptations. 149 00:15:13,860 --> 00:15:23,490 Focus your sell focus, keep focussed attention, which increases anxiety as a cue to get out of your hands and into the world. 150 00:15:23,490 --> 00:15:31,290 And finally, compassion, be kind to your mind, extend the kindness you offer others to yourself. 151 00:15:31,290 --> 00:15:34,230 The world benefits from you and what you have to offer. 152 00:15:34,230 --> 00:15:44,120 Transforming your anxiety and stress will lead to a stress free life with less stress and help you to support a path to success. 153 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:51,410 There's more about these tools in the book, Be Extorting, which is at the bottom of the slide. 154 00:15:51,410 --> 00:15:55,760 So I'd like to stop there. Thank you. 155 00:15:55,760 --> 00:16:03,650 Thank you ever so much then that that was such a clear and practical explanation based on the latest research, 156 00:16:03,650 --> 00:16:10,720 and I'm sure others will join me in having found that extremely helpful and extremely interesting. 157 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:19,190 And we've got a number of questions that have been submitted by people who have joined the set at this seminar to many really to go through 158 00:16:19,190 --> 00:16:26,870 each of them and to say what we've done instead is to try to pull out some of the key themes from the questions that have been asked, 159 00:16:26,870 --> 00:16:31,550 and we'll be asking the panel about those particular topics. 160 00:16:31,550 --> 00:16:40,520 So I'd like to just take this opportunity to introduce Polly White as well to give us wife Polly and also Robin Dunbar, 161 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:43,790 who are both also from the Department of Experimental Psychology. 162 00:16:43,790 --> 00:16:52,270 And I'm Kathy Creswell, also from the Department of Experimental Psychology, and I'll just be staring at through this next part. 163 00:16:52,270 --> 00:17:00,010 So the first question was reflects a question that came up from a number of people, and this was really about recognising that, 164 00:17:00,010 --> 00:17:09,220 of course, stress and anxiety are a normal emotions, as Jen mentioned, that are going to be understandable in difficult situations. 165 00:17:09,220 --> 00:17:17,710 So people talked about, of course, the current context. Difficult work situations when dealing with challenging interactions with other people. 166 00:17:17,710 --> 00:17:22,210 At these times, it might be easy to feel stressed, anxious, feel overwhelmed. 167 00:17:22,210 --> 00:17:31,360 And so how should we think about managing stress in those contexts when our objective reality is stressful? 168 00:17:31,360 --> 00:17:36,550 So Robyn, if I could go to you first for your thoughts on that? Okay. 169 00:17:36,550 --> 00:17:45,250 I think the starting point really is that one of the key reasons we have friendships in an ordinary, 170 00:17:45,250 --> 00:17:52,810 everyday life is that they are probably the best medicine we have for well-being and, 171 00:17:52,810 --> 00:17:58,030 you know, sort of lifting us and counteracting illnesses and all these things. 172 00:17:58,030 --> 00:18:02,530 Now, obviously, we're a bit stymied about getting out with friends at the moment. 173 00:18:02,530 --> 00:18:11,360 But the key thing is the mechanism that at least we understand underpins this and that really seems to come out of the endorphin system. 174 00:18:11,360 --> 00:18:19,660 That's what you do with friends triggers the endorphin system and endorphins just make you feel lighter and more contented, 175 00:18:19,660 --> 00:18:25,480 calmer and kind of do all the things that Jen says actually in many ways. 176 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:33,600 And those are triggered by things like laughter, singing, dancing, eating, socially, drinking, socially, those kind of things. 177 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:38,300 You know, a lot of those we can actually do at the moment virtually. 178 00:18:38,300 --> 00:18:43,840 So people are doing Zumba on Zoom and stuff like that. 179 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:51,490 Do it. I mean, it just, you know, so you come out of it. The world feels better already at the end of the session. 180 00:18:51,490 --> 00:18:57,950 So and I guess things like singing mean I'm rather bemused by the Italian 181 00:18:57,950 --> 00:19:03,070 singing from their balconies because only the Italians could do opera public. 182 00:19:03,070 --> 00:19:09,710 But you know what a brilliant idea. Everybody who's there been there at the time comes away saying this. 183 00:19:09,710 --> 00:19:16,420 This gives you such a lift. It's incredible. But at the end of the day, since a lot of these things are sort of semi social, 184 00:19:16,420 --> 00:19:22,480 there is one default thing which triggers the endorphin system like mad, and that is any physical exercise. 185 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:33,730 So my suggestion is if you can't do anything else, go for a run because every jogger will tell you the day is better after that morning jog. 186 00:19:33,730 --> 00:19:38,380 Thank you. And I definitely need a three minute carrot to get me started doing that. 187 00:19:38,380 --> 00:19:44,860 And did you have anything you wanted to add? I fully agree with Robin and the exercise. 188 00:19:44,860 --> 00:19:48,790 We think exercise is helpful because it absolutely gets you out of your head. 189 00:19:48,790 --> 00:19:54,930 So it's very it helps to disengage from the worry and the rumination that can increase anxiety and stress. 190 00:19:54,930 --> 00:20:04,330 But what the research also shows that's really helpful is to plan your workday and ensuring that you include breaks in your plan for the next day. 191 00:20:04,330 --> 00:20:06,970 And so when we're working at home during this time, 192 00:20:06,970 --> 00:20:13,090 it's so easy to be glued to the screen trying to stay afloat of emails and new work that's arisen as a result of COVID. 193 00:20:13,090 --> 00:20:13,420 However, 194 00:20:13,420 --> 00:20:22,300 it's important to structure the day and to break the day and a half hour chunks and assign tasks and include an enjoyable activity in the end. 195 00:20:22,300 --> 00:20:24,580 One of those chunks of time. 196 00:20:24,580 --> 00:20:32,350 So during your breaks and making sure you get off and out for 10 to 15 minutes and go for that run if possible, at some point during the day? 197 00:20:32,350 --> 00:20:40,420 And then I think in terms of worries, when we're alone, it's very easy to come back into our heads and give our thoughts a lot of attention. 198 00:20:40,420 --> 00:20:44,830 Our worries a lot of attention. So it's important to remember some of the facts. 199 00:20:44,830 --> 00:20:52,150 And that is, you know, 88 percent of our worries don't come true. And I think of worry diaries really helpful to help us discover that. 200 00:20:52,150 --> 00:20:57,130 And if we are getting very stressed and worried, just even, you know, 201 00:20:57,130 --> 00:21:03,010 picturing a possible plausible positive outcome and then giving ourselves a pat on the back, 202 00:21:03,010 --> 00:21:09,370 remembering that compassion that we extend to ourselves and other people actually increases our moods 203 00:21:09,370 --> 00:21:13,780 and makes us more optimistic and a better problem solver to manage the problems we may be facing, 204 00:21:13,780 --> 00:21:18,430 including our stress. So I think those are some helpful tools to add on top of that. 205 00:21:18,430 --> 00:21:24,160 And I think those are really nice points to think about in relation to. Many people are asking questions not just about the current situation, 206 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:30,730 but also general work stresses, interpersonal stressors and those sound like very good tips there. 207 00:21:30,730 --> 00:21:35,380 I was going to follow up more about stressors related specifically to the current situation, 208 00:21:35,380 --> 00:21:42,640 because obviously there are many challenges isolation, family stress, managing the competing demands of work and family. 209 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:50,700 So I think Robin and Jenny touched on this really nicely, so I'll just go to pull it out to for any additional thoughts on that. 210 00:21:50,700 --> 00:21:52,690 Yeah, thank you and thank you again for your talk. 211 00:21:52,690 --> 00:22:01,870 I really enjoyed it, and I think lots of it is really applicable for people who are in a situation where their parents took care of children. 212 00:22:01,870 --> 00:22:04,390 We've been running an online survey, actually caucus space, 213 00:22:04,390 --> 00:22:10,060 tracking the mental health of young people and working out how best to support families over this time. 214 00:22:10,060 --> 00:22:15,670 And one of the things that we found in our early findings is that the majority of parents are reporting, 215 00:22:15,670 --> 00:22:19,990 trying to juggle work and looking after children and two thirds of them feeling like they're 216 00:22:19,990 --> 00:22:24,640 not sufficiently needing that need meeting the needs of both their work and their children. 217 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:28,600 So, you know, if you're a parent in care and feeling overwhelmed, you are. 218 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:32,590 That's entirely normal. That's something that most people are experiencing. 219 00:22:32,590 --> 00:22:37,000 And I think particularly for families where you might have children that are younger or with 220 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:42,400 additional needs or there's not a parent at home to support the children with education full time, 221 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,580 you know, they're under huge amounts of stress at the moment. 222 00:22:45,580 --> 00:22:50,980 So I think the first thing to remember is that on the whole, children are remarkably resilient. 223 00:22:50,980 --> 00:22:57,730 And also, secondly, it's a really good opportunity to help children recognise that a certain amount of anxiety and stress is normal. 224 00:22:57,730 --> 00:23:01,690 But the crucial thing as a parent is really showing children how you can deal with it. 225 00:23:01,690 --> 00:23:05,590 So going back to what Jen and Robert have been talking about, you know, 226 00:23:05,590 --> 00:23:12,430 working out what you need to do to feel like you can cope and feel in control is really important and then helpful for children, 227 00:23:12,430 --> 00:23:19,390 especially those that are prone to being more stressed, helping you see that you're dealing with it in a proactive way. 228 00:23:19,390 --> 00:23:22,270 And I think also this is an opportunity to develop children's life skills. 229 00:23:22,270 --> 00:23:26,890 So maybe think about the ways your children, your family can help support things domestically, 230 00:23:26,890 --> 00:23:33,670 like cleaning and cooking and other jobs and ways that your family can enjoy time together. 231 00:23:33,670 --> 00:23:38,740 And then, you know, if the stress relates to things your children are or aren't doing, which you know, 232 00:23:38,740 --> 00:23:46,360 might be particular issues around times that teenagers are getting out of beds or, you know, engaging in work or agreeing to do some exercise. 233 00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:49,270 I think it is about being compassionate, as Jen says, 234 00:23:49,270 --> 00:23:54,940 trying to keep regular channels of communication open, finding times, perhaps when people aren't stressed, 235 00:23:54,940 --> 00:24:02,620 have regular family meetings and thinking about compromise to reach practical solutions that work to some extent for everybody. 236 00:24:02,620 --> 00:24:06,190 And then finally, you know, really trying to find the support where you can get it. 237 00:24:06,190 --> 00:24:12,100 And that might be about other people reading a story to your children over Zoom each evening, you know, reaching out to them. 238 00:24:12,100 --> 00:24:16,420 Maybe they can play games with your children using video conferencing. 239 00:24:16,420 --> 00:24:23,590 And I think again, connecting with other parents and accessing support where you need to is really, really important. 240 00:24:23,590 --> 00:24:30,160 Thank you, and I think some of those are all of those tapes are probably quite useful for us when thinking about not just challenges with families, 241 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:34,900 but any interactions we know in stressful interactions with other people and how we can manage. 242 00:24:34,900 --> 00:24:41,440 They say thank you. One of the other questions that came up quite a lot related to the fact that, of course, 243 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:46,480 there are many fundamental differences in our personalities and our biological makeup. 244 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:51,310 So to what extent is our level of the level of stress or anxiety that we experience 245 00:24:51,310 --> 00:24:56,890 really changeable versus something that some of us will just have to learn to manage? 246 00:24:56,890 --> 00:25:04,870 So Jen, could I get to you on that question? Of course, genetics do contribute to anxiety and how we manage stress. 247 00:25:04,870 --> 00:25:12,640 However, I think it's important to look at what maintains anxiety and what maintains anxiety are our thoughts and behaviours. 248 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:18,490 So it's really important to make sure that we tackle behaviours like avoidance, which we talked about in this talk, 249 00:25:18,490 --> 00:25:25,150 which increases anxiety and approach anxious thoughts with fox testing them to see how accurate they really are. 250 00:25:25,150 --> 00:25:33,490 For example, when we feel panicky, we may think that we'll pass out or we won't cope and should therefore sit down and take deep breaths. 251 00:25:33,490 --> 00:25:39,220 But unless you have a heart condition, this is the worst thing you can do. And instead, I would encourage you to do the opposite. 252 00:25:39,220 --> 00:25:46,090 So if you think you'll pass out, stand up and do some jumping jacks, you can't faint when your heart is racing, for example. 253 00:25:46,090 --> 00:25:51,790 So I really think that the key is to look at the thoughts and behaviours that 254 00:25:51,790 --> 00:25:58,540 we may be engaging in to help to break the cycle of what keeps anxiety going. 255 00:25:58,540 --> 00:26:01,690 Once we spot it, he probably did. 256 00:26:01,690 --> 00:26:03,830 Your dad, I think. Yeah. 257 00:26:03,830 --> 00:26:10,630 So actually, in the child anxiety, Lichte has been quite a lot of attention trying to understand, you know, what potentially causes it. 258 00:26:10,630 --> 00:26:16,270 And of course, it's a complex interaction between lots of different factors. We know genetics is part of that. 259 00:26:16,270 --> 00:26:24,550 So inherited genes accounts for about 30 percent of the variance when we're trying to understand what what contributes to child anxiety. 260 00:26:24,550 --> 00:26:28,450 And so one of the most robust predictors is temperament. 261 00:26:28,450 --> 00:26:35,080 So if you have the kind of temper when you tend to withdraw from things or avoid or respond fearfully to new situations, 262 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,510 then that puts you at greater risk. 263 00:26:37,510 --> 00:26:43,520 And of course, someone who's genetically predisposed might find things like the current environment just generally much more stressful to deal with. 264 00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:45,490 So there's a real interaction. 265 00:26:45,490 --> 00:26:53,890 But I think sometimes people do worry that they might be hardwired and more sort of biologically attuned to developing anxiety. 266 00:26:53,890 --> 00:26:58,330 But actually, you know, having that kind of genetic makeup is not bad news at all. 267 00:26:58,330 --> 00:27:03,280 So recently, researchers have suggested that actually, for those of us with that genotype, 268 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:07,600 we might show the largest benefit in low stress or enriching environments. 269 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:12,400 And if you think about the skills and strategies that Jens talked about or having therapy more broadly, 270 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:15,280 you can see that it's creating an enriching environment. 271 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:21,640 So and in fact, some studies have found that groups of people with more chronic genetic vulnerability actually do just as well, 272 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:25,420 if not better, when they have a psychological treatment. 273 00:27:25,420 --> 00:27:31,720 So I think it's about understanding that, of course, biological factors contribute, but that doesn't mean that you can't change, 274 00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:35,860 and being able to see that can help you let go of those unhelpful beliefs that 275 00:27:35,860 --> 00:27:41,040 things might be hardwired to see that actually change is possible for everybody. 276 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:50,010 Thank you very much. We have a lot of questions, so people were asking about how they could best support others around them with their mental health, 277 00:27:50,010 --> 00:27:55,680 so that might have been as a as a manager, as a friend, as a parent or carer. 278 00:27:55,680 --> 00:28:01,920 So we're very interested to hear your thoughts on, you know, how can each of us help others manage their stress and anxiety? 279 00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:08,580 So, Robin, if I could go to you, first of all. I think in the end, though, 280 00:28:08,580 --> 00:28:16,630 it seems to me the best thing you can do in this context is encourage people to take part in one of these kind of social activities. 281 00:28:16,630 --> 00:28:22,270 And the one we've really come to see is magic is singing. 282 00:28:22,270 --> 00:28:26,530 I mean, obviously, this is a bit there's a more general point than the current situation, 283 00:28:26,530 --> 00:28:32,680 but there are lots of choirs online that can sing sing by zoom or something. 284 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:39,580 But singing just has an absolutely magical effect on your sense of well-being and your sense of engagement with the people. 285 00:28:39,580 --> 00:28:43,990 You're doing it with complete strangers into lifelong friends. 286 00:28:43,990 --> 00:28:49,720 I mean, we've known each other forever sense in in under an hour. 287 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:56,440 It's just extraordinary that nothing else does it so well. I just kind of of it. 288 00:28:56,440 --> 00:29:00,220 There's a kind of a lot of emphasis always on sort of talking to people and getting 289 00:29:00,220 --> 00:29:06,650 them to think about the the the emotions and what they're thinking as it were. 290 00:29:06,650 --> 00:29:09,760 And I have a I have one caution to add to that, 291 00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:18,340 which is simply that this really works well for girls because that's how girls manage and maintain their social relationships. 292 00:29:18,340 --> 00:29:24,130 And it just doesn't seem to work for boys because it's not how boys create their friendship. 293 00:29:24,130 --> 00:29:33,550 Boys create friendships by doing stuff together. And then my kind of cartoon version of that is that there's the classic picture of 294 00:29:33,550 --> 00:29:39,190 two old Greek men sitting either side of a table outside a cafe with their glasses. 295 00:29:39,190 --> 00:29:47,440 Who's there in the sunshine, not speaking a word to each other, but sipping there is there from time to time and they are bonding. 296 00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:52,420 Believe me, they are bonding in a way that only boys. 297 00:29:52,420 --> 00:29:55,900 So I kind of just sort of throw that into the mix. 298 00:29:55,900 --> 00:30:06,220 When you think getting people to talk is really good because it works very well with girls and you just have to be more imaginative with blacks. 299 00:30:06,220 --> 00:30:07,480 Thank you very much. 300 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:15,700 And obviously, many people asking me questions, we're asking as thinking as in their roles, as parents or carers, if I could get to you now, Polly, 301 00:30:15,700 --> 00:30:20,410 and particularly also thinking about the extent to which the the seven tools that 302 00:30:20,410 --> 00:30:24,640 Jen spoke about apply when you're thinking about helping children and young people. 303 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:30,550 Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So I think your point is really interesting, Robyn. 304 00:30:30,550 --> 00:30:31,270 I think that's right. 305 00:30:31,270 --> 00:30:38,080 It's about achieving a balance isn't talking and opening up to some degree, but also not dwelling on it and making sure you take action. 306 00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:45,370 I think those kind of principles apply to children as well. So. So I think that's right, it is about having those conversations with children. 307 00:30:45,370 --> 00:30:49,120 And you know, some of the research that we've done really shows that children often worry about 308 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:53,470 talking about their fears because they worry about upsetting or burdening other people, 309 00:30:53,470 --> 00:31:01,300 their parents, particularly. So I think having an environment where children feel they can talk to you and their fears aren't dismissed. 310 00:31:01,300 --> 00:31:06,190 It's really tempting as a parent to sort of say it's going to be fine, you know, don't be silly, 311 00:31:06,190 --> 00:31:10,510 but actually, you know, you do want to reinforce to them, you are going to take their fear seriously. 312 00:31:10,510 --> 00:31:15,040 And it's really hard in the current environment because there is so much that we don't we're not able to control. 313 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:19,940 We can't suddenly reassure the child that their granny is going to be OK. 314 00:31:19,940 --> 00:31:26,140 We just don't know that for sure. So it's about, you know, responding the way that the child can trust. 315 00:31:26,140 --> 00:31:32,800 And I think finding time to talk to children where no one's stress or bedtimes 316 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,700 can often be a really nightmarish time when those conversations open up. 317 00:31:36,700 --> 00:31:45,250 So I think, you know, agreeing a time to to talk about it the next day can often be helpful rather than opening those conversations up now. 318 00:31:45,250 --> 00:31:49,570 And I think how Jen was talking about using dwelling as a cue to focus on other things. 319 00:31:49,570 --> 00:31:53,740 I think actually, you know, at night time that that can be particularly helpful, 320 00:31:53,740 --> 00:31:59,590 getting the child to be able to think of all the things they can switch their attention to and then maybe revisit it the following day, 321 00:31:59,590 --> 00:32:01,780 where you can do things like using the worry diaries, 322 00:32:01,780 --> 00:32:07,780 which are great and the strategies moving from Y to how I think know that's a really lovely strategy. 323 00:32:07,780 --> 00:32:13,730 That's very doable. And then I think building on everything that's been said before taking action of some kind. 324 00:32:13,730 --> 00:32:16,300 So working out, what is it the child stressed about? 325 00:32:16,300 --> 00:32:22,600 So one of the things that we've in a lot of our teenage to be talking about is worries about things being different when they go back to school, 326 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:30,400 particularly in relation to friendships and relationships. So rather than worrying about maybe friendships being different when they return, 327 00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:34,930 encouraging them to do things that make them feel more connected to friends now, 328 00:32:34,930 --> 00:32:39,040 so that might be, you know, speaking to them over the video or phone call. 329 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:46,840 Finding other ways to feel connected are really important, and we know that actually with teenagers with low mood kind of activating themselves, 330 00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:52,300 building on Jen's point about planning things in doing enjoyable activities, we know that's really, really important. 331 00:32:52,300 --> 00:32:58,650 And that can really make a difference to young people when they're feeling low and feeling a bit hopeless about things. 332 00:32:58,650 --> 00:33:03,270 Thank you. And I think very much in line with many of the themes that have come up today, 333 00:33:03,270 --> 00:33:11,100 many of the questions that we received really reflected on the unhelpful patterns that we can get into when we're under stress, 334 00:33:11,100 --> 00:33:13,740 but which then may contribute to keeping stress going. 335 00:33:13,740 --> 00:33:19,980 Say, for example, negative thought patterns, particularly destructive behaviours, feelings of guilt and shame. 336 00:33:19,980 --> 00:33:25,500 So how can we make sense of these responses and how can we change these vicious cycles? 337 00:33:25,500 --> 00:33:38,790 Robin, could I get your first? Yeah, I think my comment is simply going to be really the point that probably just made about friendships, 338 00:33:38,790 --> 00:33:42,120 such as when you re-engage with somebody after a gap. 339 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:48,180 There's an element of kind of uncertainty about the friendships, and this comes out very strongly out of everything we touch on. 340 00:33:48,180 --> 00:33:57,000 Friendship is friendships decay very, very quickly, surprisingly quickly within weeks or months in terms of their quality. 341 00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:04,800 If you don't see somebody at the normal rate and we do things like if we've not spoken 342 00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:10,470 to somebody on the phone for longer than a gap than we would normally have done, 343 00:34:10,470 --> 00:34:17,310 our next phone call with them is much longer as they were kind of trying to repair the relationship, bring it back up. 344 00:34:17,310 --> 00:34:24,840 So I kind of think it is important to kind of try and encourage people to keep those existing friendships going. 345 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:30,840 I hasten to say this doesn't happen with family relationships. Family relationships seem to be much more robust. 346 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:37,590 Families will tolerate any amount of abuse from is what seems to happen until they've had too much. 347 00:34:37,590 --> 00:34:41,790 Then it cracks, but friendships just decay very, very quickly and literally. 348 00:34:41,790 --> 00:34:48,160 Within a matter of two months, the quality of a friendship will have declined if you haven't seen them. 349 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:55,350 And so it's just encouraging people to be able to keep those relationships going by virtual means as necessary. 350 00:34:55,350 --> 00:34:58,740 When. Thank you, Adam and Jen. 351 00:34:58,740 --> 00:35:00,910 Would you like to comment on that? Yeah. 352 00:35:00,910 --> 00:35:07,860 So I think friendship and support is hugely important and but also when we're thinking about breaking the vicious cycles, 353 00:35:07,860 --> 00:35:12,570 it's it's important to recognise that our thoughts and behaviours are influencing 354 00:35:12,570 --> 00:35:17,820 how we feel and a step in feeling better is taking steps to change them, 355 00:35:17,820 --> 00:35:21,270 if possible. So if we're avoiding something like a deadline, 356 00:35:21,270 --> 00:35:32,340 our exercise will most likely feel guilty and recognising that guilt thoughts are linked to things like having sentences with the word shown in them, 357 00:35:32,340 --> 00:35:35,550 for example, like I should exercise, I should be working on this project. 358 00:35:35,550 --> 00:35:41,760 And as soon as our minds hear the word, should we instantly feel a desire to avoid what we should be doing? 359 00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:46,020 And that leads to procrastination and feelings of guilt and shame and so forth. 360 00:35:46,020 --> 00:35:52,200 So one of the tools I had mentioned was practising future feeling, thinking. 361 00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:57,960 And so that's making decisions about how you want to feel in the future and being guided by this today. 362 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:04,560 So it was really this comes under the realm of the three minute carrot. So if you know that exercising will make you feel upbeat and uplifted, 363 00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:08,850 make the decision to exercise based on how you know it will make you feel not in how you're already feeling. 364 00:36:08,850 --> 00:36:11,820 And the same applies with getting started with a deadline. 365 00:36:11,820 --> 00:36:21,450 We also spoke about a few tools in the talk that will help in relation to the three minute carrot and tips to keep going and with thoughts. 366 00:36:21,450 --> 00:36:26,700 I think we thoughts that are part of that vicious cycle that that fuels anxiety and stress. 367 00:36:26,700 --> 00:36:30,750 We it can be helpful to be open to the possibility that they're not facts and 368 00:36:30,750 --> 00:36:34,740 that we can test them and we can collect evidence for it or against them, 369 00:36:34,740 --> 00:36:43,280 and then we can update them. And then the updated thought is likely to lead to less anxiety and less less stress. 370 00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:48,260 Like you said, we are approaching the end of this session, but before we do finish, 371 00:36:48,260 --> 00:36:54,200 I would like to go to each of the panel and just ask if they have any other final comments that they'd like to make. 372 00:36:54,200 --> 00:37:01,780 So Robin. I think I just pick up on what Jim was just saying about scheduling. 373 00:37:01,780 --> 00:37:07,420 I mean, that's clearly really in many ways the secret to it and being a bit disciplined about it. 374 00:37:07,420 --> 00:37:13,480 But it just made me think that actually, if you make a little slot for some sort of exercise, you know, 375 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:23,620 it doesn't matter whether it's going for a jog, as you can do down through the woods as it were or Zoom Zoom bear on Zoom, as they say. 376 00:37:23,620 --> 00:37:28,570 The thing about exercise is once you get into the swing of it, it makes you want to do it again. 377 00:37:28,570 --> 00:37:36,640 So there's a kind of incentive to keep making a slot available, so I'd go for a little gentle exercise. 378 00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:41,740 It's always good for the mind. Thank you. Any final thoughts for me? 379 00:37:41,740 --> 00:37:45,070 Yeah. Well, a few weeks on a few weeks ago on Twitter, the writer, 380 00:37:45,070 --> 00:37:49,990 Damian Barr posted a poem and and it sort of recognised that the fact and I think it came 381 00:37:49,990 --> 00:37:52,630 from the fact that a lot of people are talking about us all being in the same boat. 382 00:37:52,630 --> 00:37:57,670 And he talked about, we're all in the same storm, but we might not all be in the same boat. 383 00:37:57,670 --> 00:38:02,000 And that really resonated for me because I think the reality is that people are 384 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:05,860 in all sorts of different situations right now that may not be comparable, 385 00:38:05,860 --> 00:38:10,600 and some people might be in a much less watertight, seaworthy boat than others. 386 00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:15,100 And I think it's just about not beating yourself up if you find yourself in a situation that is so 387 00:38:15,100 --> 00:38:22,480 much more challenging than other people and just looking for things like what can you control? 388 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:25,630 What activities give you a sort of sense of belonging, a sense of purpose? 389 00:38:25,630 --> 00:38:30,430 What can you do to kind of show your boat up and get as much support as you possibly can? 390 00:38:30,430 --> 00:38:33,940 And, you know, things like getting outside in nature, doing exercise, 391 00:38:33,940 --> 00:38:38,140 all the things we talked about, I think, are really important trying to notice the positives. 392 00:38:38,140 --> 00:38:42,400 You know, the fact that you might have a bit more time in bed, you might be able to wear comfortable clothes. 393 00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:48,220 You might not be a technological genius. You know, all of those things, I think trying to harness them. 394 00:38:48,220 --> 00:38:53,440 But at the end of the day, being compassionate towards yourself and others and not giving yourself a hard time if you're 395 00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:58,540 not being productive in the way that you'd like to or potentially might see other people being. 396 00:38:58,540 --> 00:39:08,440 Thank you, Jen. Any final thoughts for me? Yeah, I think it can be helpful to recognise that what we're going through, whilst it is a massive change, 397 00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:14,140 it is also temporary and we are changing day by day in terms of the information that 398 00:39:14,140 --> 00:39:19,090 we get and the plans that we have in relation to keeping safe with coronavirus. 399 00:39:19,090 --> 00:39:24,220 And whilst we are at home, it won't be forever and we will be able to socialise at some point. 400 00:39:24,220 --> 00:39:32,500 So sometimes just knowing that the situation that we're in, however anxiety and stress filled it is as temporary can be helpful. 401 00:39:32,500 --> 00:39:39,880 And the other thing that I think is really important that I'd like to get across is how important it is to get out of our heads. 402 00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:46,780 And I don't mean blind drunk, but I mean, how important it is to shift our attention away from our thinking and getting 403 00:39:46,780 --> 00:39:51,310 into the outside world or the task at hand can really reduce stress and anxiety. 404 00:39:51,310 --> 00:39:56,140 And this is one of the reasons why exercise is so helpful because when we are exercising, 405 00:39:56,140 --> 00:40:04,000 it's actually really hard to also be be worrying and dwelling about things from the past. 406 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:08,800 So I think that can be very helpful. And I think also, you know, finally, 407 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:16,210 the sense of compassion so important to speak to ourselves with kindness in this lower stress hormones makes us more optimistic 408 00:40:16,210 --> 00:40:23,020 better problem solvers to solve the stress that we are experiencing whilst we're going through this corona pandemic. 409 00:40:23,020 --> 00:40:28,245 So compassion is really, really important for ourselves and for other people.