1 00:00:01,300 --> 00:00:11,440 Thank you very much, Simon and Paula, for inviting me and for organising this really exciting opportunity of the world. 2 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:22,950 I guess that we live in that. We have to do all online, but it's a great chance of speaking with people and not around our dreary island. 3 00:00:22,950 --> 00:00:27,740 And I want to start my talk with Andrew question. 4 00:00:27,740 --> 00:00:32,240 And it sounds like a very simple question is who is John's baby? 5 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:38,010 And it seems very simple because everyone has heard about John baby. 6 00:00:38,010 --> 00:00:43,030 She has been present in the public imagination of India since at least seventeen hundreds. 7 00:00:43,030 --> 00:00:49,620 Is a royal type painting. Usually Hawking is a symbol of leadership by the side of Ackbar or Christmas Day. 8 00:00:49,620 --> 00:00:57,670 Mariah is or she appears in some writings as a role model for young women next to a moron luxury Bibles. 9 00:00:57,670 --> 00:01:03,970 John C is Seeta or Inverne and Mother Teresa. 10 00:01:03,970 --> 00:01:15,720 Historical novels in Hindi Canada and the English commemorate her, as well as an issue of the graphic novel in it of the IMRT truck attached series. 11 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:22,210 Her memory appears to have a life of its own in a way, but this memory seems to exist out of history. 12 00:01:22,210 --> 00:01:27,100 In a way, modern historiography is not much helpful here. 13 00:01:27,100 --> 00:01:35,830 In the few books we have on the history of the day, consultants acceptor position of power. 14 00:01:35,830 --> 00:01:43,840 No one ignores her, but there is no questioning of the environment that made a hair appearance possible. 15 00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:44,470 Instead, 16 00:01:44,470 --> 00:01:57,700 both academic and popular work emphasise her uniqueness by placing her somehow as not standing as part of feast or just stepping outside history. 17 00:01:57,700 --> 00:02:04,480 But John Bibby's very much of historical figure who played an important role in two courts in Bridgeport, 18 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:15,580 in Nagano and in very particular moments, is such her actions were anchored in particular political settings and social practises. 19 00:02:15,580 --> 00:02:26,080 In this paper, I tried to explain her career on this big round of these choreography around her employing Persian Chronicles as our main source. 20 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:35,050 I argued that her actions do not fully, fully conform to the analytical frameworks commonly used elsewhere in the early modern Muslim world. 21 00:02:35,050 --> 00:02:39,370 This indicates potential limitations of this very framework, 22 00:02:39,370 --> 00:02:53,270 suggesting that we need a more nuanced view to understand questions of gender household in on the margins of this Persian world. 23 00:02:53,270 --> 00:02:58,940 So examining child B B presents a basic problem in the context of the consultants. 24 00:02:58,940 --> 00:03:04,070 Questions of gender in royal household attract very little attention. 25 00:03:04,070 --> 00:03:09,800 Fortunately, this issue is discussed deliberately in other parts of the early modern Muslim world, 26 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:14,480 and the discussion offers us a very good entry point. 27 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:20,420 And in particular, I have the Mughal context to even mind. So in the 16th century, 28 00:03:20,420 --> 00:03:28,940 the organisation and concept of the state underwent significant changes with a IMPAC which impacted 29 00:03:28,940 --> 00:03:37,160 the way in which the royal household operated with the intensification of hierarchical structures. 30 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:47,480 The royal household increased in significance and its role was systematised useful, even if a little bit dated then problematic. 31 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:57,620 Way to look at this is the association with the very end model of the patrimonial bureaucratic state adopted by Stephen Blake to the Mogel case. 32 00:03:57,620 --> 00:04:04,190 This a shift in the relationship between a state and household, 33 00:04:04,190 --> 00:04:13,550 was both instrumental and reflective of the profound ideological shift in the very idea of kingship of empire, 34 00:04:13,550 --> 00:04:19,670 to which sexuality millenarian Nisan and the body of the king became central. 35 00:04:19,670 --> 00:04:29,090 The elevation of the political and symbolic position of the king and his household defined not only the state as a whole, 36 00:04:29,090 --> 00:04:33,590 but also as it is so much attached to the household. 37 00:04:33,590 --> 00:04:40,650 Also, gender relations became very important in its functioning and definitions. 38 00:04:40,650 --> 00:04:50,330 In our very own Rosalind O'Hanlan demonstrates that the gendered terms were significant in the articulation of the king in the household. 39 00:04:50,330 --> 00:04:58,560 The King became the what you call the embodiment of male virtue, then dissipated code from the nobles. 40 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:07,100 Likewise, likewise emphasised masculinity in the construction of the imperial moral framework. 41 00:05:07,100 --> 00:05:13,250 On the other side of the process, the position of royal women, it was heavily regulated. 42 00:05:13,250 --> 00:05:21,800 They were venerated. So they became or they were squeezed up the hierarchy along side, the rest of the household. 43 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:29,390 But within the household, their position was increasingly enclosed and restricted. 44 00:05:29,390 --> 00:05:34,250 So we can talk about two kinds of separation emerging in this period. 45 00:05:34,250 --> 00:05:44,910 First is physical space, which the royal family occupied, was reorganised to promote, quote, new ideologies. 46 00:05:44,910 --> 00:05:49,820 The art historian Gurel eligible to suggest that gender was central to the spatial 47 00:05:49,820 --> 00:06:00,800 organisation of the policies and what she terms as a women were kept away from public view, 48 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:14,980 regardless of their actual power or. If they were physically separated and therefore could take this up, as said are. 49 00:06:14,980 --> 00:06:19,420 It is through the services of my sister and others. 50 00:06:19,420 --> 00:06:27,940 The second set of separations or dividing lines is not physical as much as discourtesy. 51 00:06:27,940 --> 00:06:33,730 I've mentioned the ideological and ethical works that define domestic relations in 52 00:06:33,730 --> 00:06:40,330 the royal household and in further out to nobles and increasingly larger spiracles, 53 00:06:40,330 --> 00:06:50,140 as discussed by by in all, O'Hanlan, more broadly official chronicles did not leave much space for royal women. 54 00:06:50,140 --> 00:07:01,480 Just like in the physical world. Their appearance in the text was highly regulated, usually in association with their gendered role in the household, 55 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:06,400 building an image of a charitable and or benevolent state, 56 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:12,820 or maintaining a dynastic stability within the royal family, for example, in the case of rebelling princess. 57 00:07:12,820 --> 00:07:19,270 So their role was very clear in smoothing things up within the royal household. 58 00:07:19,270 --> 00:07:28,840 These mentions, these limited mentions of women only emphasise the role within clearly defined spaces. 59 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:33,400 How does Choung Baby fit into these kind of narratives? 60 00:07:33,400 --> 00:07:40,690 For most of her lifetime, her actions and the discussions there all fit well into these patterns. 61 00:07:40,690 --> 00:07:48,260 She was born on an undisclosed date. It was not reported by the chroniclers to Saddam Hussein. 62 00:07:48,260 --> 00:07:53,320 These, I'm sure, the first of Ahmed Nagar and how a Hunza double. 63 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:59,620 And she was the sister of the future Sultan's Mortaza, the first and more than the second. 64 00:07:59,620 --> 00:08:05,350 First time we ever hear about her was in fifteen sixty four as part of Marriage Alliance. 65 00:08:05,350 --> 00:08:15,490 She was married to Ali Adeel Shah, the first of Egypt for. While Ali's sister married a child, Beebees Brother Mutasa, and moved to Almoner. 66 00:08:15,490 --> 00:08:21,370 This agreement was part of building a military alliance against Wichai, another leading to the best of Stanly, Qatar. 67 00:08:21,370 --> 00:08:28,540 A few months later, in moving to be deported, Bibi returns to obscurities. 68 00:08:28,540 --> 00:08:34,650 So we have this very passive mention of my mentioning of her for four. 69 00:08:34,650 --> 00:08:42,210 One moment, and then she disappeared for 15 years, so her name surfaces again only in 15 18, 70 00:08:42,210 --> 00:08:47,670 following destination of her husband, Ali, the sultan left no issue. 71 00:08:47,670 --> 00:08:53,010 It was agreed amongst the nobles to install a nine year old boy named Ibrahim on the throne. 72 00:08:53,010 --> 00:09:01,440 This is, of course, a braggy Myrtle Beach. The second the reign of any young boy usually brought it to political struggles in the 73 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:08,610 court to run the identity of the region with the promise of the one who holds it. 74 00:09:08,610 --> 00:09:15,880 This put in this position of rich a region and a lot of power influence. 75 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:20,070 And because still the household was central to this process, 76 00:09:20,070 --> 00:09:28,290 it really allowed women to play an important role within the restrictions that we marked before. 77 00:09:28,290 --> 00:09:34,640 So in the next few years, we see continuous struggles between few regions and rural women. 78 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:39,240 We don't have time to get into details. I just want to mention a few points. 79 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:44,340 So Chad Beebees first mentioned in this context, the court historian Furi Starr, who wrote later, 80 00:09:44,340 --> 00:09:52,800 Fourie breaking the second, then a child a saltum, reports that she was put in charge of the sort of education. 81 00:09:52,800 --> 00:10:00,500 Clearly, domestic activity. Her role became more explicitly political in the coming years. 82 00:10:00,500 --> 00:10:06,570 The first region commun often tried to sway the horyn by installing his people in key 83 00:10:06,570 --> 00:10:13,590 positions and actually paid personally it to two staff in order to buy their loyalty. 84 00:10:13,590 --> 00:10:18,750 In response, we see we see child baby writing letters to other nobles. 85 00:10:18,750 --> 00:10:24,840 They had to mobilise them to stage a coup against him in favour of another Regent Kishwar. 86 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:28,300 It worked for her case rather than. 87 00:10:28,300 --> 00:10:37,050 It rose to power himself, trying to undermine the royal household by accusing China baby of inciting her brother Mortaza. 88 00:10:37,050 --> 00:10:40,830 By then, the Sultan Ahmed Nagata invade. 89 00:10:40,830 --> 00:10:49,620 He even sent Eunuch's and women of his own household to take charge Bebe out of the harem and imprisoned her in Satara for it. 90 00:10:49,620 --> 00:10:57,720 This was seen as a breach of etiquette. Bring it to an uprising that forced Kishwar home and out of Beachport. 91 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:01,050 The following region brought baby back to the capital. 92 00:11:01,050 --> 00:11:11,010 But at this point, we see her position declining it in favour of Ibrahim's actual mother, whose name we do not know. 93 00:11:11,010 --> 00:11:16,230 And she, the mother, continued to maintain the harem as an important power centre. 94 00:11:16,230 --> 00:11:27,930 But Child B B is kind of fizzling from record with her declining position and breaking in coming of age by fifteen, eighty five. 95 00:11:27,930 --> 00:11:38,130 She returns to her ancestral mother. So notwithstanding the impressive a power she mastered chumpy Beziers in Egypt for a or at 96 00:11:38,130 --> 00:11:44,880 least the representation thereof comply with the boundaries with Mark before she appears. 97 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:49,200 Only when her presence was needed to protect the royal family too. 98 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:59,720 In her case, a political marriages and the defence of the minor saltum from the use of affection of an oh by overenthusiastic noble. 99 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:04,380 The spatial aspect follows the lines that we have seen in the bluegill case. 100 00:12:04,380 --> 00:12:08,160 The one time that she leaves the hyrum is not voluntary. 101 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:21,930 And even though Kishwar Han kept Pada a rules by sending women and Eunuch's, the action was seen as severe and he was penalised for it. 102 00:12:21,930 --> 00:12:25,560 Not much has change upon Child Bebes returned to Ultimate Snugger. 103 00:12:25,560 --> 00:12:35,940 And we heard nothing about her for a decade, even as the SML sentiment was experiencing an existential, existential crisis. 104 00:12:35,940 --> 00:12:42,090 But with the death of her brother, war hardened the second in 50 95, he surfaces again. 105 00:12:42,090 --> 00:12:47,280 And here is where we see the really interesting things that made her famous. 106 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:53,890 So as we have seen, the royal woman could not act independently, but only in the interest of a male sovereign. 107 00:12:53,890 --> 00:13:01,410 John Beebee understood it and chose to show initiative instead of letting others decide the identity of the successor. 108 00:13:01,410 --> 00:13:06,570 She promoted her own candidate. Her great nephew, Bahadoor. 109 00:13:06,570 --> 00:13:10,320 She was not the only one who thought about this trick, though. 110 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:16,600 And in the coming months, we see different parties fighting over which influence or which member. 111 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:22,890 Denise, I'm sure her family would be the legitimate her child be manoeuvre her way between those 112 00:13:22,890 --> 00:13:29,760 parties and position herself as the only viable option in Arma Douga itself in the capital. 113 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:36,330 Her success attracted more nobles to the to her camp, gradually building her power base. 114 00:13:36,330 --> 00:13:43,270 Now, Prince Bahadoor was not enough. But now was kept imprisoned by one of her rivals in the latter. 115 00:13:43,270 --> 00:13:49,260 But this allowed her to step away from the norms within which you operate. 116 00:13:49,260 --> 00:13:57,270 The historian Tabatabai reports and I'm quoting here, In order to appease the minds of the nobles and the commoners, 117 00:13:57,270 --> 00:14:06,930 Her Majesty Bill keeps carrying the banner of Alexander the Great appeared from one of the seats of those bastions on her son resembling sells. 118 00:14:06,930 --> 00:14:14,550 Her parasol of divine shadow was like the loftiness and grace spreading Twinstar of Polaris. 119 00:14:14,550 --> 00:14:26,760 It was a third luminary. These parcels Private Phoenix, like wings of Felicity and prosperity, casting the shadow of the dynasty over kingdom. 120 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:31,830 And people know this position is very unusual. 121 00:14:31,830 --> 00:14:39,960 For the first time we encountered Child B, living the harem at the harem voluntarily and appearing in public, 122 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:47,430 breaking both spatial and discursive walls while acting in the name of another king. 123 00:14:47,430 --> 00:14:52,010 She used the royal insignia to present herself as the sovereign. 124 00:14:52,010 --> 00:14:57,450 The chronicler takes part in this effort by employing astrological terminology to 125 00:14:57,450 --> 00:15:04,920 present divine blessing to her role in a manner typical elsewhere in the Persian world. 126 00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:12,840 And he continues, I'm quoting here. The one who is known as Assistance of God, the Ben Efficient ruler, 127 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:19,980 the victorious over rebels and enemies chant beebees to return the honour of the two worlds, 128 00:15:19,980 --> 00:15:29,700 meaning to be sent the next world asylum office lament the Muslims shelter of the weak and the wretched daughter of the late Satanism Shah, 129 00:15:29,700 --> 00:15:38,670 who is a Jamsheed like emperor whose armies like Alexander's, whose turban is like the sun and whose court is like heaven, 130 00:15:38,670 --> 00:15:45,960 may ally extend the ropes of the tent of her compassion in the shadow of Her Majesty. 131 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:56,970 Elevate the banner of victory and extend her remaining months and years on the crossroads of the two worlds, which is reference to Earth. 132 00:15:56,970 --> 00:16:02,910 With this passage tabatabai, he cements Child Bebes position as a sovereign. 133 00:16:02,910 --> 00:16:10,310 He strongly diverges from the tradition that Aso's associates royal women with certain qualities. 134 00:16:10,310 --> 00:16:14,070 So well, look, occasionally he is using the term or the name BCE. 135 00:16:14,070 --> 00:16:18,410 The Queen of Sheba. A common way to call royal women throughout the Persian. 136 00:16:18,410 --> 00:16:23,490 It is writing and notes. She is herself a sovereign. 137 00:16:23,490 --> 00:16:32,250 She is the Queen of Sheba. The bulk of the narrative does not attribute Bibi with feminine qualities such as chastity and modesty. 138 00:16:32,250 --> 00:16:41,070 And we actually see those attributes used when she is described in Beachport, but not by tabatabai in number. 139 00:16:41,070 --> 00:16:50,430 Instead, she is depicted in masculine qualities emanating from herself and positioned as a success or of her father. 140 00:16:50,430 --> 00:16:55,600 Note that Warren is not appearing in the story at all. Sorry Bahadoor. 141 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:59,490 A great-nephew though fishless over it now. 142 00:16:59,490 --> 00:17:04,470 This did not end the political troubles and we see potential candidates to replace Charles Beebees. 143 00:17:04,470 --> 00:17:08,790 My lurking kept appearing in. One of them is very interesting. 144 00:17:08,790 --> 00:17:13,530 It's the septuagenarian Sharlie son of Abraham the first. 145 00:17:13,530 --> 00:17:19,260 So a child beebees uncle in December with a fifteen ninety five. 146 00:17:19,260 --> 00:17:28,430 The Moghuls also. Being with Prince Maraud besieging the Capital Child, Beebe wrote to all party leaders for help and some complied. 147 00:17:28,430 --> 00:17:38,870 Even Charlie. Her uncle arrived in the capital. But even this moment with a mature male member of the new Somchai family child position is a 148 00:17:38,870 --> 00:17:45,860 position does not seem to be challenged at all and suggests that she was actually widely accepted. 149 00:17:45,860 --> 00:17:48,830 This allowed her to continue with royal duties, 150 00:17:48,830 --> 00:17:59,840 which tabatabai a reports aim is including taking care of the army and religious matters and all matters of government. 151 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:09,510 This leadership is reflected in the following interesting case for which we have two versions, and it's interesting to compare them. 152 00:18:09,510 --> 00:18:12,110 So after a few months of siege, 153 00:18:12,110 --> 00:18:22,190 the moguls managed to explode a mine under the wall of Ultimate Nagara and created the breach in these traumatic moments. 154 00:18:22,190 --> 00:18:32,570 Though, of course, the very literary descriptions of the commanders running away and hiding in corners and a cannell's. 155 00:18:32,570 --> 00:18:36,980 But this is where things get very unusual. 156 00:18:36,980 --> 00:18:39,320 Tabatabai report, and I quote, 157 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:48,920 The commanders and notables has them to the Queen's attendance in order to strengthen her warriors and to ensure the continuation of the battle. 158 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:59,030 They brought her from the horror to the place of the breach. When the sun resembling parcel of that built kiss, which carries the banner of Solman, 159 00:18:59,030 --> 00:19:05,450 cast the shadow of protecting and favour over the heads of the noble of the nobles. 160 00:19:05,450 --> 00:19:16,940 It increased the power and ability of Damaris like warriors a thousand times more and brought their once strong hand a out of the sleeve of bravery. 161 00:19:16,940 --> 00:19:24,640 Once again, Tabatabai emphasises her bodily presence and visibility is a key to motivating people. 162 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:30,080 This telling is particularly interesting, comparing to the version told by FURI staff. 163 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:39,770 Then in Egypt, where he left a usmanov are about six or seven years before that and they quote, fury, stop beating. 164 00:19:39,770 --> 00:19:47,450 Upon hearing about the terrible incident War de Boer called Puton are more and barefoot. 165 00:19:47,450 --> 00:19:53,210 She took a sword in her head with a group of men who were present in her service. 166 00:19:53,210 --> 00:20:00,890 She gracefully walked out of the harem, approached the wall on a horseback and went towards the breach. 167 00:20:00,890 --> 00:20:05,720 The people of the fort felt obliged, and from corners where they have been hiding. 168 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:12,800 They hacked into her attendance. The stories are similar, including the significance of chant beebees presence. 169 00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:16,640 Yet she reached to emphasise it's much more feminine aspects of her. 170 00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:23,030 First of all, the borca to make sure that we don't even think that she's not keeping some sort of PADA. 171 00:20:23,030 --> 00:20:27,680 So she's veiled and she keeps her chastity. 172 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:34,520 She walks gracefully and the part of her visibility is somewhat underplayed. 173 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:46,280 Note also the absence of the parasol, the symbol of sovereignty which Tabatabai emphasises, but it's abandoned for something quite weird. 174 00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:55,060 Did the idea of our more and sort barefoot. This emphasises yet another masculine quality. 175 00:20:55,060 --> 00:21:04,310 Tabatabai attributes to her. And this is bravery and actually decided bravery appears even a infuriation does 176 00:21:04,310 --> 00:21:10,400 takes and the Mogel Fluffy Climbable wrote some century a bit over a century later. 177 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:19,010 But it's a mere footnote for them. For tabatabai it becomes a very central aspect of her reign. 178 00:21:19,010 --> 00:21:26,120 And he read reports that during these events, elephant drivers tried to shield her from enemy fire. 179 00:21:26,120 --> 00:21:32,000 But she refused and expressed her willingness to die by the hands of the enemy. 180 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:35,810 So at the end of the affair, the moguls were pushed to negotiations. 181 00:21:35,810 --> 00:21:43,760 Naturally, Channel B b a oversaw the negotiations as the actor or the sovereign in practise A tabatabai. 182 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:48,710 He used the negotiations to again position her as an accepted sovereign. 183 00:21:48,710 --> 00:21:52,080 He reports that the bluegill field commander, Sadiq Mohammed, 184 00:21:52,080 --> 00:22:01,220 utterly said to Channel B b m m to to channel Beebe's representative a f their son in a quote. 185 00:22:01,220 --> 00:22:10,280 You are waiting and hoping, like a unique that the woman in the fourth will come to your rescue or that you will get assistance from her. 186 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:16,220 Thus, of course, insulting his masculinity by the very fact that he's serving a woman. 187 00:22:16,220 --> 00:22:20,520 These did not convince of the harm to express his longstanding loyalty to the. 188 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:25,680 Memories of the day come once again, emphasising Child Beebe's role as a sovereign. 189 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:30,450 Of course, we have to remember that this text is written by the one source who is trying to 190 00:22:30,450 --> 00:22:36,540 emphasise a child beebees leadership and not necessarily records a real conversation. 191 00:22:36,540 --> 00:22:45,060 But this is another way in which tabatabai construct in gender issues into this narrative. 192 00:22:45,060 --> 00:22:48,930 At the end of the affair, a treaty was eventually signed. 193 00:22:48,930 --> 00:22:54,840 But it's three years, three, four years later, a Ackbar move south. 194 00:22:54,840 --> 00:23:08,070 He's army now under a prince. Daniel arrives in the four Chumby be understood that at this time she would not be able to resist in open negotiations. 195 00:23:08,070 --> 00:23:16,050 Several commanders blamed her for conspiracy with the moguls, and she was assassinated in sixteen hundred. 196 00:23:16,050 --> 00:23:26,760 How can we make any sense of this really unusual story and of the way the person narratives tell it? 197 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:39,980 In part, the story follows the in lines known elsewhere in the Persian world, appearing in particular times and in particular a role. 198 00:23:39,980 --> 00:23:46,800 Is the royal woman protecting a young sovereign or in marriage in which is very passive. 199 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:53,730 But her final years are very different off. And I want to emphasise a few points here. 200 00:23:53,730 --> 00:24:03,270 First of all, she shows that great initiative not in taking advantage of an existing opportunity by but by creating one for herself, 201 00:24:03,270 --> 00:24:10,080 pushing someone that she knows that she will be able to control. Second is with the assistance of tabatabai. 202 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,200 She built her position as a sovereign on her own right. 203 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:21,960 Even if not officially using both symbols of royalty and male attributes, in a sense, she is positioned not as a queen. 204 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:30,630 But if we think about it carefully about the imagery, she is actually the king of Fatima, another third. 205 00:24:30,630 --> 00:24:34,890 She defied all spatial norms by showing herself in public. 206 00:24:34,890 --> 00:24:39,480 And lastly, The Chronicles did not use her gender against her. 207 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:43,740 Of course, not about Tobii. But not all Sophia restyled, she Rasi. 208 00:24:43,740 --> 00:24:50,760 The other two main sources from the dead come both under patronage of Femme Ibrahim of the. 209 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:56,490 The second was very sympathetic with her. So that might be part of the story. 210 00:24:56,490 --> 00:25:04,860 But all these presents strong divergence from the practise elsewhere in the early modern period in the Persian that world. 211 00:25:04,860 --> 00:25:15,810 I suggest to see this as a manifestation of the unique character of the local political EPM as the royal household seats within the political system, 212 00:25:15,810 --> 00:25:21,840 varieties of state structures would naturally affect the gendered aspect of it. 213 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:26,670 And here I followed the work of the feminist geographer Doreen Massey, who links together. 214 00:25:26,670 --> 00:25:34,920 Gender roles is structures of society and the constructions of space. 215 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:38,610 These variations are difficult to trace as our main sources. 216 00:25:38,610 --> 00:25:46,620 The Chronicles operate within the same discourse, discursive realm of the early modern powers in the world. 217 00:25:46,620 --> 00:25:53,580 These can explain the silence around Child Beeby, except in those moments when such references were acceptable. 218 00:25:53,580 --> 00:25:59,790 For example, marriage period the frequency. But this observation explains the discourse. 219 00:25:59,790 --> 00:26:04,350 We remain with the question why was the story so different? 220 00:26:04,350 --> 00:26:11,730 How did it all? What were the circumstances that enable her to work? 221 00:26:11,730 --> 00:26:24,330 I suggest that we have to read it, not as a person. That story of a Muslim, a queen, as much as a comic story, or at least to examine this option. 222 00:26:24,330 --> 00:26:28,380 I argue elsewhere that the debt consultants did not replicate the imperial 223 00:26:28,380 --> 00:26:34,800 models of the Muslim East is most expressed by the Mughals and the Ottomans, 224 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:44,910 but created their own version of the state in which local idioms were significant or even central in shaping the political language. 225 00:26:44,910 --> 00:26:53,580 In a less regulated way, it may be then that the local language allowed Chumby B to operate this way. 226 00:26:53,580 --> 00:27:07,710 So it so successfully. The terror historian tried to quantify the in2 the Persian discourse by tracing the origin of this action is not easy. 227 00:27:07,710 --> 00:27:15,240 And this is where we have a little bit of a problem and they have to suggest something quite speculative. 228 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:20,300 While working against proper is a historical process. So going in the wrong. 229 00:27:20,300 --> 00:27:28,730 Direction here. There are a few interesting examples from the decades after her death that might be interesting here. 230 00:27:28,730 --> 00:27:33,640 For example, there's the opium. Hamid Hamid come and he's unnamed. 231 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:38,690 The wife took over political affairs in now going to 16 teams. 232 00:27:38,690 --> 00:27:43,100 And the sources talk about them as a couple running the show. 233 00:27:43,100 --> 00:27:44,690 In the mid 17th century, 234 00:27:44,690 --> 00:27:55,010 we see the wife of an unnamed Deshmukh of mother or leading armies against the moguls gaining her the name right, boardgame or tigress. 235 00:27:55,010 --> 00:28:02,690 And there is, of course, no need to introduce two very important women of the Poncelet family, 236 00:28:02,690 --> 00:28:14,340 G.J. by she bodgies mother and she bodgies daughter in law, Tara Bai, who both had an extremely important political a role. 237 00:28:14,340 --> 00:28:18,780 Now, exemplars before China, we are much more difficult to find. 238 00:28:18,780 --> 00:28:25,110 But we do have one. And this is China beebees mother kinds dough, my own who after the death of Hussein, 239 00:28:25,110 --> 00:28:30,600 the first acted as the all powerful, rich regent of her son Mortaza. 240 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:39,840 The resemblance of the two women was noted even by the chronicler Shirazi of Beachport, who says it explicitly. 241 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:44,700 So far. It's still a story that we might know from many places. 242 00:28:44,700 --> 00:28:48,810 But there is one unusual thing about sons of openly. 243 00:28:48,810 --> 00:28:59,370 And this is her depiction in this series of images in the royal copy of the Planet Gericke text Tarifa a Tarifa Hussein Shuhui. 244 00:28:59,370 --> 00:29:07,830 From the copies from fifteen sixty five a few months before those things that marks the Brodsky's suggests that her position is very unusual. 245 00:29:07,830 --> 00:29:17,580 Her not only as official painting of the Queen, but she is positioned as a consort of a Hindu God. 246 00:29:17,580 --> 00:29:25,050 Now, this last comment offers the possibility that we have here a local tradition that at the same time made 247 00:29:25,050 --> 00:29:32,940 Chang Bebes actions acceptable and stood at odds with the norms of the early modern royal household. 248 00:29:32,940 --> 00:29:38,040 So as a concluding remark, I think that understanding Chumby B is a maverick, 249 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:43,910 exclaims neither her character nor the history of ultimate nougat or did they come as a whole. 250 00:29:43,910 --> 00:29:54,150 An analysis of our actions within the norms set by the Persian sources is also problematic as the sort of graphical framework itself, 251 00:29:54,150 --> 00:30:02,910 one that marks her as a neutral, seems ill suited to accept the fact that we have such a big variation, 252 00:30:02,910 --> 00:30:12,780 and in particular when we think who were the target audiences of the writers of this chronicler, people who share these values of the present world. 253 00:30:12,780 --> 00:30:22,240 So instead they suggest that we should think of ways to integrate these local circumstances and practises in to the understanding of women. 254 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:32,220 David, royal household in the state in the early modern world and to the way in which we read to those in sources which are not 255 00:30:32,220 --> 00:30:43,380 complying to these practises in order to find signs of this kind of locality in these Persian and cosmopolitan writing? 256 00:30:43,380 --> 00:30:53,810 I think that this is it for me. Thank you very much, Rod Roy, for a very interesting paper. 257 00:30:53,810 --> 00:30:58,800 Participants are most welcome to put questions in the comment box. 258 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:09,620 But since we are in the in the in this kind of organiser room, I believe any of the organisers here in this room, 259 00:31:09,620 --> 00:31:19,500 Polly Shraddha, anyone else would like to go first and asking a question. 260 00:31:19,500 --> 00:31:27,840 Shannon, can you help me? The comment box is that I'm not quite sure whether comment boxes. 261 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:30,930 I see it as a little too little sound. 262 00:31:30,930 --> 00:31:42,570 Voice bubbles next to the taskbar and it says Q and a Q is it said, yeah, it's like we have in Q any so you can eat if you type in there. 263 00:31:42,570 --> 00:31:47,310 So idea. Okay. But you can ask ask your questions verbally. 264 00:31:47,310 --> 00:31:52,230 Everybody would like to hear it. Yes. Sorry. Thank you very much in Detroit. 265 00:31:52,230 --> 00:31:56,910 Of course you took as many fascinating applications. 266 00:31:56,910 --> 00:32:10,950 And I mean, can we see these perceptions at least of Chan baby as being connected with the much more, you know, obviously with the ADEC, 267 00:32:10,950 --> 00:32:20,340 any Milia in which warrior peasant communities with with horizontal ties of 268 00:32:20,340 --> 00:32:27,780 allegiance rather than less rather than more vertical forms of social organisation. 269 00:32:27,780 --> 00:32:39,240 Is does this belong to a tradition of independent, powerful women, of the sort that back by the 18th century is becoming a kind of cliche? 270 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:44,540 You know, you'll know that the 18th century remarks about these Morato women, 271 00:32:44,540 --> 00:32:49,560 they're very bold and they ride around everywhere on horseback showing their faces and and so on. 272 00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:58,080 I mean, it could could we see is that where you think Choung Babies, these illustrations of Chan Baby belongs? 273 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:05,620 I, I do. I really do. I think that there is no. 274 00:33:05,620 --> 00:33:15,250 There is no other way to understand her. She definitely is not within this cosmopolitan Islamic militia. 275 00:33:15,250 --> 00:33:26,430 She cannot sit there in and. This tension between her behaving in a certain way and the fact that it is never used 276 00:33:26,430 --> 00:33:32,650 against her suggests that there is something in the social media that allows it. 277 00:33:32,650 --> 00:33:45,540 And and in that sense, I do think and in letting other places, I show how strongly or at least how strongly the early martyrs, 278 00:33:45,540 --> 00:33:51,990 the 17th century martyrs remember Ahmed Norgaard, kind of part of their media. 279 00:33:51,990 --> 00:33:55,680 And they do think that, yes, they were operating along similar lines. 280 00:33:55,680 --> 00:34:01,470 The problem is that and that's the chronological problem, is that we have this cliche of the 18th century. 281 00:34:01,470 --> 00:34:06,940 But to what degree can we apply to the 16th century? 282 00:34:06,940 --> 00:34:15,350 And I don't know if we have sources to say anything about these meetings in the 16th century in. 283 00:34:15,350 --> 00:34:20,370 Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Thank you. Thank you. 284 00:34:20,370 --> 00:34:25,110 That's all kinds of promising, interesting, intriguing directions for research. 285 00:34:25,110 --> 00:34:29,790 I see there are other questions now. I'm sure Charlene will want to put them to you. 286 00:34:29,790 --> 00:34:37,950 Yes, that's fine. There is one question from Shaunak and it says, Thank you for such a fascinating door. 287 00:34:37,950 --> 00:34:42,390 Professor Fishell, your analysis of John Beebee was extremely insightful. 288 00:34:42,390 --> 00:34:50,730 Could you tell us about John Beebees negotiations with Abdul Rahim Hanif Atmar during the brutal siege of Mohammad lugger? 289 00:34:50,730 --> 00:35:00,270 Secondly, and in that vein, how is Charn Beebee represented in contemporary war will push in sources. 290 00:35:00,270 --> 00:35:09,820 In. We don't have that much about her in the Moghuls sources, so including the side of the negotiations. 291 00:35:09,820 --> 00:35:19,480 It is mentioned by a father. But it is a very brief affair that it kind of. 292 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:25,220 She's there in. From. 293 00:35:25,220 --> 00:35:27,620 Yeah, I'll have to go back to the sources I had. 294 00:35:27,620 --> 00:35:36,830 I don't have a very good response now, just from my impression of the past is that she's not downplayed, 295 00:35:36,830 --> 00:35:44,390 but the whole affair is kind of pushed a little bit aside then negotiations. 296 00:35:44,390 --> 00:35:51,320 I mean, in 50, 95, 96, because they were a little bit of an embarrassment to the moguls. 297 00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,370 They came. Prince was sent and was defeated by them. 298 00:35:55,370 --> 00:35:59,600 So they didn't have much interest in elaborating there. 299 00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:09,110 So much we do know that eventually is the result of the negotiations was in that channel. 300 00:36:09,110 --> 00:36:19,920 BBC did a bearer to the moguls and the moguls took over, sent one of their commanders, 301 00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:27,120 was actually originally the governor of there are a after fifteen seventy after 302 00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:31,490 Ahmed Nagar conquered the region and then defected to the side of the moguls, 303 00:36:31,490 --> 00:36:40,810 returned with their army, took over and the nobles who served Ahmed go into place just in. 304 00:36:40,810 --> 00:36:44,770 Made mogul control over the region. Impossible. 305 00:36:44,770 --> 00:36:56,170 And that's why that was the mogul excuse to taking over it, over it or restarting the campaign against Ahmed Norgaard. 306 00:36:56,170 --> 00:37:03,490 I will need to revisit Abu Refusal to give you a better answer them that, I'm afraid. 307 00:37:03,490 --> 00:37:09,430 Thanks. The second question is from Rahul's McGarr, and he asks Ibrahim. 308 00:37:09,430 --> 00:37:15,520 The second wrote a poem on John Beebee in which she was treated like a noble queen, 309 00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:20,770 but not as a warrior or administrator who played an important role in the Decken. 310 00:37:20,770 --> 00:37:28,660 How do you look at this in the context of rivalry between the techniques alternates in it? 311 00:37:28,660 --> 00:37:35,500 It's an excellent question. First of all, in his poems, it's always unclear who he means. 312 00:37:35,500 --> 00:37:45,820 It might be that it's not the D child B B because he has poems on trying to be in a little bit more amorous way. 313 00:37:45,820 --> 00:37:51,660 So I really want to believe that it's not about his arms. 314 00:37:51,660 --> 00:37:56,590 And it's a very common trope, kind of common title. 315 00:37:56,590 --> 00:38:05,200 Second, by the time that Ibrahim writes his poems in particular after sixteen hundred, there is no rivalry with Ahmad. 316 00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:11,350 Another Ahmad Nagar is almost a. 317 00:38:11,350 --> 00:38:17,500 Well, it's almost a dead horse. It's the capital is conquered. 318 00:38:17,500 --> 00:38:22,870 We have money come out, organise a organise. But there is no real competition between royal houses. 319 00:38:22,870 --> 00:38:29,440 So in that sense, by that time, it is all declined in that sense. 320 00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:37,150 So did the competition that we may have seen a bit earlier and continuing for much later in between BJP and Golconda. 321 00:38:37,150 --> 00:38:42,520 Ahmed Gnangara is kind of out of the game by 16. A hundred. 322 00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:54,710 And the last bit about that is the relationship between midnight, between midnight going to be the BJP or when China Bibi is in charge M. 323 00:38:54,710 --> 00:38:56,690 In a way, 324 00:38:56,690 --> 00:39:06,800 significant part of the power that a child be was able to maintain or convince others to cooperate with them was with Ibrahim's army at the border. 325 00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:11,240 Willing to help her. And it was clear the sources are quite clear about. 326 00:39:11,240 --> 00:39:19,250 And that's why I said that. M Chronicle. Rita Mandery breaking most sympathetic to her m. 327 00:39:19,250 --> 00:39:27,230 It is m very much kind of an. 328 00:39:27,230 --> 00:39:35,480 Let's say it is her endeavour. But it seems like the relationship remained very good for quite some time. 329 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:47,120 Back to the first point, it just popped into my mind about share images, even if it is these Tranby that he writing a on in his poetry. 330 00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:52,970 Ibrahim is talking about a beauty and wisdom in music. 331 00:39:52,970 --> 00:39:59,480 It's not also very much in war infused kind of writing. 332 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:07,190 And it might be that the is part of the way that he describes the ideal in 333 00:40:07,190 --> 00:40:12,830 person that he said he does not talk about himself in military terms either. 334 00:40:12,830 --> 00:40:16,130 So in that sense, that might explain it. 335 00:40:16,130 --> 00:40:20,300 Yes. Thanks. Unfortunately, we are running out quickly out of time. 336 00:40:20,300 --> 00:40:25,940 But there is a question about Prachi Despond Day, which has received a lot of attention from the participants. 337 00:40:25,940 --> 00:40:29,470 And I think this is going to be probably the last question that we can take. 338 00:40:29,470 --> 00:40:33,920 But the rest of the questions, what I'm going to do is I'm going to send it to you, Roy, 339 00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:41,810 and then you could take the liberty to respond to them, you know, privately provided where they are. 340 00:40:41,810 --> 00:40:45,170 The e-mails of all the participants will be available through Claire. 341 00:40:45,170 --> 00:40:51,920 So, you know, we could we could set up a network in case people want to have their questions answered at a later date as well. 342 00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:56,030 I hope that's all right with you. Yeah. Look, I love the crutches practise. 343 00:40:56,030 --> 00:41:03,500 Question is, can you say a bit more about the feminist geography framework you are invoking and how it might help 344 00:41:03,500 --> 00:41:12,050 understand gender representations of the region or of the individual figures in the subcontinent? 345 00:41:12,050 --> 00:41:23,000 We got to make this snappy in three minutes. That's in. 346 00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:31,640 This is an issue that started being used. It's a terrific question and really it's one that needs more attention. 347 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:46,070 I think, generally speaking, in the way that we look at a history, so A during Massey and others, we have Martina live a little bit about that. 348 00:41:46,070 --> 00:41:53,070 They used the net in the framework of the first generation of feminist geographers from the 70s. 349 00:41:53,070 --> 00:42:03,950 Aim to create an understanding of construction of space is represent, first of all, as M. 350 00:42:03,950 --> 00:42:09,020 And that's a three. Mussie is changeable all the time. 351 00:42:09,020 --> 00:42:23,870 So space is not set, but it is always responding to and associated with the changing circumstances and the social affairs which is responding to them. 352 00:42:23,870 --> 00:42:29,600 So if we look at the activity of women, what is permitted, what is not permitted, 353 00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:36,020 where they can venture, where they can transgress norms or what the norms are. 354 00:42:36,020 --> 00:42:42,220 We cannot talk about this kind of over all a IDL. 355 00:42:42,220 --> 00:42:46,200 In lying around them, that's the way that I take it to history. 356 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:53,070 But we have to look at the particularities of certain circumstances and to embrace the 357 00:42:53,070 --> 00:43:01,620 fact that they constantly change in order to to to understand the broader social setting. 358 00:43:01,620 --> 00:43:09,060 That's really in a nutshell. She wrote quite a few books about the hits. 359 00:43:09,060 --> 00:43:18,090 But Abertay really thinks that a good starting point is to engage with the work of wealth during May Massie. 360 00:43:18,090 --> 00:43:24,510 Thanks very much, Roy. I think we are just right on on the Q. 361 00:43:24,510 --> 00:43:25,374 I had a question on.