1 00:00:00,420 --> 00:00:04,140 This is your work. Thank you. 2 00:00:06,810 --> 00:00:12,410 So thank you all for coming to our final also seminar for the year, the academic year. 3 00:00:12,750 --> 00:00:16,980 And I've just been reminded that this is the final also coming. 4 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:20,130 But don't forget, we've got the Roger Cook lecture, the 31st of May. 5 00:00:20,340 --> 00:00:25,620 You do actually need to sign up so that we know how much. Why? You should think so. 6 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:30,250 So please do sign up for the Roger Howard lecture, which is coming up on. 7 00:00:30,730 --> 00:00:37,440 But today we have Dr. Creative Phillips from the LSC and Dr. Alex Thomas from our very own 8 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:42,810 department here to discuss some findings from what I think is ongoing life histories. 9 00:00:42,930 --> 00:00:47,920 So right, so happenings like this trace research from their research, 10 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:55,170 it's actually research that's funded by the British Academy that they're doing with the groups of minority ethnic men in London. 11 00:00:55,800 --> 00:01:03,390 Coretta is associate professor in the Department of Social Policy at the LSC and Alpha is department a lecturer here, both, 12 00:01:03,390 --> 00:01:09,600 as I'm sure you're all aware, published widely in area in a range of areas to do with race, ethnicity and criminal justice. 13 00:01:09,960 --> 00:01:15,540 With recent publications by Coretta about travellers and by alpha on policing immigrants. 14 00:01:16,440 --> 00:01:20,700 They can talk for now, so you will have time for discussion. So think you guys. 15 00:01:20,790 --> 00:01:26,550 Thank you. Good afternoon. Everyone in the stations was about that. 16 00:01:27,090 --> 00:01:31,979 And we should say as and when we start looking at these things, it's very much a work in progress. 17 00:01:31,980 --> 00:01:40,680 So appreciate any constructive comments and would be interested in my thoughts on trying to do so. 18 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:50,000 The way we've organised the presentation say so I'm gonna if they're wrong, you're going to. 19 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,230 It's not your fault to listen to what strikes me. 20 00:01:54,180 --> 00:01:57,180 Sorry, I get it. 21 00:01:59,130 --> 00:02:04,940 That is really. There is an angle. She wants a little thing. 22 00:02:05,820 --> 00:02:11,180 Sorry, I'll take it. So it's for me. 23 00:02:11,190 --> 00:02:14,220 We got it right? Sure. 24 00:02:15,300 --> 00:02:18,620 Okay. Okay. 25 00:02:18,650 --> 00:02:25,790 Sorry about that. So the way you will finish the presentation is I'm going to check on the backward search context for our study. 26 00:02:26,870 --> 00:02:30,269 And also then took a bit more back to theoretical framework. 27 00:02:30,270 --> 00:02:37,219 But when you see it flying today and Alison to talk about methodology to assess a sample and then 28 00:02:37,220 --> 00:02:42,470 we're going to introduce to by line history participants excited about their stories of summary, 29 00:02:42,740 --> 00:02:48,620 lots of history, their stories so far. And then we're going to get into the research findings, 30 00:02:48,620 --> 00:02:57,140 which is essentially centring on the idea of the possibility of racialized worldviews and the way in which this may impact findings. 31 00:02:57,470 --> 00:03:05,570 And then hopefully we have lots of time for questions. So what we're talking about, sides, Mary said in the instruction, 32 00:03:05,570 --> 00:03:14,389 was some small scale qualitative life history research with mostly young men of diverse racial, 33 00:03:14,390 --> 00:03:23,780 ethnic or religious backgrounds, all with minority ethnic origin, apart from a small sample, has some mix issue, but primarily identified as white. 34 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:29,120 And we do have one young man assigned to the consulting work. 35 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:33,230 The research was trying to understand a bit more about how some minority ethnic groups 36 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:38,719 are much more likely to get caught up in the criminal justice system than others. 37 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:45,440 And we began to teach them about risk and risk factors and protective factors. 38 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:51,860 And so in a sense, that situates our research within like police criminology, exams and criminology, 39 00:03:52,070 --> 00:03:58,550 although of course asking primarily an incentive to enhance what we did is very much qualitative. 40 00:03:59,180 --> 00:04:05,090 But of course this research is interested in looking at the pathways in society and 41 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:10,489 understanding what the risk factors might be that promote those offenders in that race. 42 00:04:10,490 --> 00:04:20,710 And then to look at tiny points which create pathways away from offending in schools resistance, persistence and resistance. 43 00:04:22,370 --> 00:04:30,079 And so this is in some senses says there's actually been quite a lot of criticism. 44 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:33,950 Of course, black girls, community excitement, the patterns of criminology, 45 00:04:34,310 --> 00:04:40,250 particularly in the way in which it tends to focus on recent experience and behavioural change, 46 00:04:40,670 --> 00:04:48,050 where there is a micro level context and hasn't been able to accommodate structural 47 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:52,910 inequalities in the way that structural context influences the life experiences. 48 00:04:53,840 --> 00:04:55,639 But I think having said that, 49 00:04:55,640 --> 00:05:04,820 my state by state would agree that something the labs work does a better job of sorry legal science and that allows research, 50 00:05:04,820 --> 00:05:08,870 which is I think pretty highly regarded to recognise is really formative, 51 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:18,850 not least because they also draw on a lot of history elements that research in addition to the constraints of long longitudinal designs. 52 00:05:20,810 --> 00:05:33,020 So what our research suggests in brief is that childhood and adolescence delinquency is much more likely where this weak informal session control, 53 00:05:33,020 --> 00:05:39,290 and they focus particularly on the family and schools institutions as informal session control. 54 00:05:40,910 --> 00:05:48,290 And then in that world of assistance, they took that turning points and they look at life transitions, 55 00:05:48,290 --> 00:05:51,740 particularly employment and supportive romantic relationships. 56 00:05:52,160 --> 00:06:01,730 Marriage is that focus very much in order to understand what can influence language intelligence in a way from effective behaviour. 57 00:06:03,410 --> 00:06:12,170 Now something in the lab so interesting our age draws on the full extent of that, which is a large sample of white male influences. 58 00:06:12,170 --> 00:06:21,460 They were affected study and also a control group of non-significant young white men go back to St Philip 59 00:06:21,470 --> 00:06:27,680 and through and in their second look they actually followed people right through to the age of 17. 60 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:34,400 The ONS this is a really impressive not least because they didn't have a great date of attrition in that study. 61 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:43,460 So more generally, there's been a criticism of this kind of research for not being able to say very much about race. 62 00:06:43,670 --> 00:06:47,240 Sampson now has an entirely black sample. 63 00:06:47,510 --> 00:06:56,329 Many of the other datasets haven't had she she racially diverse some samples, but where there has been some research in this area, 64 00:06:56,330 --> 00:07:05,260 there's generally been an acknowledgement that time points are likely to occur at different times, in different ways. 65 00:07:05,280 --> 00:07:11,570 The minority ethnic group sorry, young folks, younger and older men, 66 00:07:11,630 --> 00:07:16,600 most of the focus has been focussed on men and some of this literature refers to that. 67 00:07:17,140 --> 00:07:27,580 Cheers to death, which is essentially arguing that for minority ethnic young men and women, we can extrapolate on gender grounds. 68 00:07:28,090 --> 00:07:37,920 They have less access to legitimate opportunities and therefore to successful pro-social turning points, both socio economically. 69 00:07:38,380 --> 00:07:43,840 And that's why we tend to see less persistence amongst minority ethnic groups. 70 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:49,840 Now the problem for us in a sense, is that there's no real equivalent in the UK context. 71 00:07:50,290 --> 00:07:57,250 So we have the Edinburgh Study of Youth Transitions, which is hugely impressive piece of work, 72 00:07:57,400 --> 00:08:02,500 but it's based in Edinburgh and Edinburgh actually has a majority white population. 73 00:08:02,500 --> 00:08:13,450 It's 96% at the time of the census in 2001 and even fiction as well, so relies on a very, 74 00:08:13,450 --> 00:08:17,920 very small minority group, something called group, so very much that race. 75 00:08:19,510 --> 00:08:25,780 So what we want to do as our starting point today was to think about the idea of shared beginnings. 76 00:08:25,780 --> 00:08:31,280 And that's the part. It's actually the science of allow in insights. 77 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:37,390 And the second one, which shows that shared beginnings, divergent lives. 78 00:08:38,260 --> 00:08:42,150 So what we're interested in really is interrogating that notion, 79 00:08:42,190 --> 00:08:49,000 considering the validity of the idea of shared beginnings, where we take account of racial discrimination. 80 00:08:50,140 --> 00:08:56,650 And I think it's really important for us to be completely upfront at the outset and recognise that the young 81 00:08:56,650 --> 00:09:05,800 people that we spoke to shared many of the risk factors which influence or propel people towards attainment. 82 00:09:05,810 --> 00:09:08,889 Take it even if they don't want to accept it, encourage it. 83 00:09:08,890 --> 00:09:17,920 And so we took two people that had considerable sector economic constraints that experience residential mobility. 84 00:09:19,450 --> 00:09:27,220 They often had disrupted family relationships, and they also experience many of the kind of traumatic, 85 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:34,450 miraculous events which we know increase the likelihood that people will be vulnerable to both offending and victimisation. 86 00:09:35,410 --> 00:09:40,720 So we're not trying to suggest that there is something unique in that about our sample. 87 00:09:41,170 --> 00:09:50,740 But what we want to do is think about the way in which racism might compound those structural inequalities, those adverse situations. 88 00:09:50,770 --> 00:09:54,640 Context in which minority men and women. 89 00:09:57,820 --> 00:10:02,229 Now, most of you will be not will be aware of that, thanks to lots of discussion, 90 00:10:02,230 --> 00:10:09,129 including by the director here of what's recognised as a very productive debate, 91 00:10:09,130 --> 00:10:17,350 focussed on how we explain the representation of some of our men and women in our prison populations, 92 00:10:17,530 --> 00:10:20,590 not just in England and Wales but in many other jurisdictions as well. 93 00:10:21,310 --> 00:10:31,270 And of course these ideas at various points in time, fairly regular intervals, permeate the political consciousness and public consciousness. 94 00:10:31,270 --> 00:10:34,540 And that's very much what's happening in my life in relation to knife crime. 95 00:10:34,900 --> 00:10:45,820 So we see periodically a focus by the police and policy attention on particular kinds of what are seen as typically black crimes. 96 00:10:47,260 --> 00:10:53,290 If we step back and say family circle elements of the rising crime crime side, 97 00:10:53,290 --> 00:11:00,700 we can actually get back to African-American solid boys for work in Philadelphia, 98 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:05,739 experienced African-Americans thinking about the role of elevated threats of 99 00:11:05,740 --> 00:11:10,390 offending as opposed to discrimination throughout the criminal justice process. 100 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:17,260 And of course, traditionally we focussed very much on the case that increasingly we're recognising African America, 101 00:11:17,560 --> 00:11:20,110 recognising the importance of border agents as well. 102 00:11:20,830 --> 00:11:30,370 But we can also, interestingly, traces back to Amber, also a piece look at patterns of homicide in the U.S. at the end of the 19th century. 103 00:11:32,260 --> 00:11:42,280 Now, critical criminologists have generally argued and colleagues at critical criminologists in this country at least are actually mainstream. 104 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:50,650 Criminologists tend to focus on language educated rates detected amongst minority ethnic people, 105 00:11:50,950 --> 00:11:59,020 results from adverse structural conditions, which satisfies macro and micro level factors in criminal activity. 106 00:11:59,650 --> 00:12:03,700 And, you know, these debates persisting perhaps in many other places as well. 107 00:12:04,450 --> 00:12:13,780 What we've become interested in is essentially one block, which is looking at the language experiences of racial discrimination at the macro level. 108 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:20,049 So in atypical interactions both within but also perhaps more on the outside of 109 00:12:20,050 --> 00:12:25,390 the criminal justice system provides or certainly some of this research suggests. 110 00:12:25,390 --> 00:12:34,870 But I think convincingly that there's a solid link between the experience of racial discrimination and offenders in crime, 111 00:12:34,870 --> 00:12:37,240 delinquency and also what we it. 112 00:12:38,140 --> 00:12:47,500 So essentially you put simply the argument is that experiences of racial discrimination increases the risk of criminal offending. 113 00:12:49,510 --> 00:13:00,190 So we just see as example here that this scholarship calibre is one of the main slogans associated with this research. 114 00:13:00,580 --> 00:13:05,590 And what she argues that she's talking about the US context, that she argues that racial minorities, 115 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:15,850 young people essentially learn that they can legitimately justify that portion of crime because they've learned through 116 00:13:15,850 --> 00:13:24,560 their everyday lives that physical deferred gratification does not ultimately lead to rewards for people like them. 117 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:32,500 People like us, I guess. So the world is hostile and also that social rules are not applied equally. 118 00:13:33,070 --> 00:13:38,200 And their argument is that these life lessons are sold as social stigma, 119 00:13:38,530 --> 00:13:43,800 which essentially on the basis of meaningful past actions, influences teaching. 120 00:13:45,610 --> 00:13:52,300 And so they see this social schema map influences what they call criminology knowledge structure. 121 00:13:52,750 --> 00:14:03,370 So just move on. It's nice to see chaos in the middle in which which essentially promotes impulsivity, immediate gratification. 122 00:14:04,030 --> 00:14:06,609 It promotes hostile views of relationships. 123 00:14:06,610 --> 00:14:14,290 And the argument here is that, in essence, if you are persistently exposed to antagonistic relation relationships, 124 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:23,380 this leads to individuals imputed negative intentions, which requires coercive and aggressive behaviour response. 125 00:14:24,010 --> 00:14:29,540 And then the last element, they argue, is this disengagement from conventional looks. 126 00:14:30,670 --> 00:14:41,139 The dataset that they used was six ways of Paradise from the American Family Community Health Study of African-Americans living in Iowa and Georgia. 127 00:14:41,140 --> 00:14:47,890 And they've got a sample of just over 600 likes across the neighbourhood racial composition and also 128 00:14:48,190 --> 00:14:56,100 economic governance like that in these last two studies to date self-report family data and it sounds. 129 00:14:56,220 --> 00:14:59,730 These are family members and young people themselves. 130 00:15:00,420 --> 00:15:08,370 So in this study, which coincidentally started in the same time period as the Edinburgh study, and so 1998, 131 00:15:08,370 --> 00:15:15,420 it starts with young people who are aged six, 12 and the plans to follow them up to 23 to 25. 132 00:15:16,650 --> 00:15:24,660 So they collected these, as I said, the self-report data, but they also use what's called the section of racist events. 133 00:15:25,380 --> 00:15:28,470 And this tested sections of racial discrimination. 134 00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:39,270 They used a range of questions asking people about their perceptions of unfair treatment by a whole range of different groups and teachers, 135 00:15:39,270 --> 00:15:47,720 neighbours, colleagues, co-workers, health professionals, neighbours and including friends. 136 00:15:47,730 --> 00:15:52,710 And they're asked about these experiences in the previous year and then also across their lifetime. 137 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:57,870 The questionnaire also asks about being unfairly suspected of doing something wrong, 138 00:15:59,020 --> 00:16:02,940 having their intentions misunderstood, feel badly abused and bullied. 139 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:10,380 And also interesting, they asked about emotional responses to those experiences where people say they have been victims, 140 00:16:10,390 --> 00:16:18,510 and that's what's so interested in emotional reactions and also practical actions taken in response to perceived racism. 141 00:16:19,410 --> 00:16:20,250 So in essence, 142 00:16:20,250 --> 00:16:29,010 what this kind of research is trying to do is identify and they use the like at scale for responses in relation to all of these questions. 143 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:38,940 They're interested in measuring what they call culturally specific stressors which are out there, essentially personal attacks on the self. 144 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:47,880 And unsurprisingly, the vast majority of the sample have experienced racial discrimination across the lifetime, maybe also in previous year. 145 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:51,540 And what their research shows is very complicated. 146 00:16:51,990 --> 00:16:59,760 As one of my colleagues, Suzanne, squiggles apologies to instinctive researchers in a very complex way. 147 00:16:59,760 --> 00:17:05,790 They identify this not only an association between experiences of racial discrimination, 148 00:17:07,050 --> 00:17:15,840 but actually they found that these experiences were a predictor of involvement in offending and that these injured time. 149 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:19,200 Another fault is what we've been really interested in. 150 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:25,950 This has been by showing damage on an African-American scholar and his colleague, James, in fact. 151 00:17:26,460 --> 00:17:30,840 And essentially that makes some very, very similar kinds of arguments. 152 00:17:31,290 --> 00:17:32,459 And in essence, 153 00:17:32,460 --> 00:17:42,060 what they argue is that African-Americans operate within a with a racialized worldview in which they experience that prison in light of that cost. 154 00:17:42,570 --> 00:17:46,710 And that cost is just humiliated recipients of racist treatment. 155 00:17:47,190 --> 00:17:52,350 And therefore, they anticipate systemic racism in American society. 156 00:17:53,010 --> 00:18:04,070 And they say these this policy block argument leads to weaken social ties to institutions and making such a job. 157 00:18:04,470 --> 00:18:12,360 So essentially, after through the argument, the sympathy to these African-Americans show weaker bonds to white dominated institutions. 158 00:18:12,630 --> 00:18:17,400 So that focuses primarily on states and the labour market. 159 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:23,370 And this, say our view, produces what makes Western allies and behaviours which maintains defending. 160 00:18:24,660 --> 00:18:27,020 What's also interesting from our point of view, 161 00:18:27,030 --> 00:18:37,320 although not something that we can say very much about and all dataset is again a huge part of work in the US and a smaller body of work in the UK, 162 00:18:37,590 --> 00:18:45,690 which identifies a link between experiences of discrimination and racism and adverse mental health outcomes. 163 00:18:47,220 --> 00:18:57,210 And so this research also importantly recognises that the discrimination precedes the of negative things of past outcomes. 164 00:18:58,020 --> 00:19:04,800 So the argument here is that threats and assaults on individuals, cultural self identities, 165 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:13,500 it's all due to produce psychological symptoms, depression, anxiety, even trauma and can have a detrimental effect on physical health. 166 00:19:14,460 --> 00:19:23,850 And I've just included here one. So I didn't make it on slide. 167 00:19:24,120 --> 00:19:33,920 But in relation to adverse mental or physical health outcomes, that's one piece of research was conducted that wasn't concentrated on cycling. 168 00:19:34,050 --> 00:19:39,750 New York hundred 50 interviews with African-Americans of diverse social classes. 169 00:19:40,380 --> 00:19:50,130 And in this study, Flemming and colleagues report respondents feeling that defined self isolate themselves as either scrutinised, 170 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:54,600 overlooked, underappreciated, misunderstood and disrespected. 171 00:19:54,870 --> 00:19:59,009 And what's important, I think, for those of us that experience racial discrimination, 172 00:19:59,010 --> 00:20:10,960 will also recognise that that requires coping skills and it requires also a considerable amount of emotional energy in processing those experiences. 173 00:20:11,220 --> 00:20:19,890 And often and often also a sense of then to integrate hypervigilance and those kinds of experiences. 174 00:20:20,910 --> 00:20:27,479 What we don't know is whether the reactions to experiencing racial discrimination vary. 175 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:36,780 We might assume that it's very much lost by history and also over the life skills, and we don't really have very much research on that. 176 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:46,260 So all of this research aftermath sounds really useful about some of these issues in context of London sample. 177 00:20:47,820 --> 00:20:53,879 But what's I think important is that these inherent design of these kinds of studies, 178 00:20:53,880 --> 00:21:00,810 I think, precludes more of a holistic sense of what be exposed to racism, 179 00:21:00,810 --> 00:21:06,660 to potentially traumatic stress across the life course can actually feel like, 180 00:21:07,020 --> 00:21:15,750 particularly when it's combines with experiences, the kind of usual responses, structural inequalities, poverty, disadvantage. 181 00:21:16,710 --> 00:21:26,310 It's probably immediately obvious that our small scale research isn't necessarily the best way to really examine this new, complicated context. 182 00:21:26,730 --> 00:21:32,720 But we think we have some data which is at least indicative of similar patterns of rates and pay, 183 00:21:33,830 --> 00:21:39,930 and has a plan to support the methodology and sample. 184 00:21:52,180 --> 00:21:56,710 Thanks, Coretta. So White House history. 185 00:21:56,740 --> 00:22:01,870 So to begin with. So I just took that stuff, that research, 186 00:22:02,380 --> 00:22:11,320 and they really emphasised the qualified data that's derived from systematic open ended questions or narrative life histories. 187 00:22:11,660 --> 00:22:20,290 They're actually quite crucial in uncovering the social processes that underlie stability and change in criminal and deviant behaviour. 188 00:22:20,650 --> 00:22:25,870 So we were really interested in trying to capture this through using the the life history approach. 189 00:22:26,350 --> 00:22:34,090 We're also really attracted by the fact that life histories tend to capture human agency structure and culture. 190 00:22:34,730 --> 00:22:38,710 They're able to reveal the ways in which these processes intersect. 191 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:43,900 So we were hoping to get very strong from adopting this approach as well. 192 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:47,020 So as I say, 193 00:22:47,170 --> 00:22:56,720 other people like Sharp really to have this stuff that the life history method captures involves mistake ascending and disengaging from crime. 194 00:22:56,740 --> 00:23:05,950 So besides the importance to deconstruction, what's really important as a lens through which to understand long term persistence. 195 00:23:06,220 --> 00:23:13,990 I'm not trying to shout around. Talks that have existence inherently in and of itself is not a turning point, 196 00:23:13,990 --> 00:23:20,170 but rather it's the process that it that it creates where that person in terms of their reflection. 197 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:24,880 So the idea was that we are more likely to get that through the last history approach. 198 00:23:26,290 --> 00:23:32,199 And more recently, and perhaps controversially, those who still roll with life history research, 199 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:38,200 where people such as Max Presser have argued that by engaging in life history, 200 00:23:38,590 --> 00:23:47,760 it's these people not only representing their past, but also shape that future actions actually. 201 00:23:48,100 --> 00:23:55,180 Which is really interesting for us, particularly because our sample is quite young comparatively. 202 00:23:57,090 --> 00:23:59,960 And I'm also thinking about. Right. 203 00:24:00,010 --> 00:24:08,770 So although there's still a recognition that individual lives are a significant part of the broader racial order in which they cast, 204 00:24:09,370 --> 00:24:19,480 this does not produce the anticipated attention to be able to take city identities like lives and social processes such as affairs. 205 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:29,320 So in fact, lives have been sidelined, assets to understand the minutia of social effects generated by racialized processes. 206 00:24:30,190 --> 00:24:38,290 So the assets in which the individual has simply served as a screen answer, which the Socialist Project text, which how long was talked about. 207 00:24:39,820 --> 00:24:49,750 So really. So without life histories with just that, it's not clear how race operates as part of the left individual or sanctioned identities. 208 00:24:50,290 --> 00:24:54,670 So the question is what does race mean in the context of individual lives? 209 00:24:55,030 --> 00:25:03,070 By what mechanisms are lives raised in our and therefore to insert the individual into the analysis of race. 210 00:25:04,180 --> 00:25:10,209 It seems also that in trying to understand the subtle oppression of rights as passed by, 211 00:25:10,210 --> 00:25:19,480 that as part of our identity and the parts of social process, broader social process is not actually an easy task. 212 00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:26,710 And this is because there's a sense in which race house this this embeddedness which persists. 213 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:31,360 It's a distance and the effects of race almost beyond question. 214 00:25:31,930 --> 00:25:35,680 So that comes through with this notion that race is always at play. 215 00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:46,900 But at the same time, this ubiquity, which succeeds in putting race at the centre of social concerns, renders it inaccessible to analysis sometimes. 216 00:25:47,620 --> 00:25:58,270 So the argument is we believe that life histories that all with the same approach are more likely to enable that to shift from ubiquity, 217 00:25:58,630 --> 00:26:00,070 but that enough social, 218 00:26:00,070 --> 00:26:12,280 structural and cultural practices which have a bearing on biostatistics so say ultimately through the secondary insertion of the individual 219 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:21,730 into the analysis of race and an understanding of the cumulative effects of everyday racism which capture the flight to social poker actions, 220 00:26:21,970 --> 00:26:29,200 verbal messages, or signals that are racist, which Philomena, Asad and Jo figure and have talked about. 221 00:26:34,980 --> 00:26:46,200 So methodology. The answer is correct. To look at our overarching question is actually why are some minority ethnic young men more likely to 222 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:53,549 engage in criminal funding and disproportionately comprise the arrested prison population than upwards, 223 00:26:53,550 --> 00:26:58,440 despite sharing this seminal demographic and socio economic background? 224 00:27:00,360 --> 00:27:06,090 In order to do this, we employed 2 to 3 interviews with each participant. 225 00:27:06,540 --> 00:27:12,270 We undertook oral history training, which is really fantastic. 226 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:18,209 But that enabled it kind of taught us how to listen to to ask the right questions, 227 00:27:18,210 --> 00:27:25,920 to try and sustain what was going on in people's lives and access to. 228 00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:32,490 So suddenly we wanted to gain access to as broad a range of young people as possible. 229 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:38,850 And we did this through contacting local sports and community organisations across London. 230 00:27:38,850 --> 00:27:46,120 So the virus that we worked in, that the census were based in places like Greenwich, Hattersley, 231 00:27:46,150 --> 00:27:55,559 Newham, Tower Hamlets and some other parts of China, and we also employed different methodologies. 232 00:27:55,560 --> 00:28:04,500 So we used photo elicitation aslo to try and capture some of the abstract, more abstract ideas around identity and belonging. 233 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,319 And we also used in the act. 234 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:18,990 So what we did is we presented the young people with examples of the court sentencing procedure and different applications to minority ethnic groups. 235 00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:26,339 And similarly, a police example, I think this was one of the ones that we used to really try and get the young 236 00:28:26,340 --> 00:28:31,440 people to think hypothetically that if you observe this going on practice, 237 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:41,940 would you perceive that to be discriminatory or not necessarily a process of engagement as you might expect? 238 00:28:41,940 --> 00:28:50,489 It generated a really strong sense of rapport with our participants, so I ended up helping a couple of the white students. 239 00:28:50,490 --> 00:28:59,100 At the end of the interviews, one of one of my participants had been driving a car without a license for about seven years. 240 00:28:59,580 --> 00:29:06,690 And so we we got stopped there and we applied to charity to see if they paid to take his driving test. 241 00:29:06,690 --> 00:29:10,980 And they did shockingly pass that time, of course. 242 00:29:13,290 --> 00:29:19,800 But that was in which you really got this continuity of sense of relationship with looking after people. 243 00:29:20,100 --> 00:29:23,160 I think Jack wanted to access participants. 244 00:29:23,790 --> 00:29:29,580 I was looking at applying to university and take advice from Krach about that too. 245 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:36,900 So a sense in which we we were able to go beyond simply extracting information. 246 00:29:36,900 --> 00:29:45,719 That's well done. And one of the comments that we had at the end of our interviews so number of people was that it 247 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:51,750 really did enable this reflection for all the participants at this crucial juncture in their lives. 248 00:29:51,750 --> 00:30:01,800 So what if Michael Spence talks about how important, how you selected to reflect back on the decisions that you've actually made? 249 00:30:02,490 --> 00:30:09,120 So I think to me, the overall strategy, the methodology that we adopted, we say, 250 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:23,970 was this hugely successful and we recorded all of the interviews and helping transcribe professionally, and that's how to turn on as we go. 251 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:39,910 And this is our sample. So so far, we've collected 21 life histories of young black young men and one woman aged 16 to 25 in London. 252 00:30:40,450 --> 00:30:46,690 As you can tell, the sample is extremely diverse ethnically and with so on going, 253 00:30:47,050 --> 00:30:50,470 as we said at the beginning, so ongoing with the data collection phase. 254 00:30:51,250 --> 00:30:58,450 And we felt we feel as though this sample is more realistic in terms of its capture of ethnic and religious diversity. 255 00:31:00,030 --> 00:31:06,700 And question I actually pointed about how some of these participants might complete a census category. 256 00:31:07,060 --> 00:31:10,420 So the question that you see, I think could be quite difficult factually, 257 00:31:10,780 --> 00:31:16,540 but it really reveals the fluidity and movement of of ethnicity things actually. 258 00:31:23,460 --> 00:31:28,560 And these are some of our the question things that we adopted. 259 00:31:28,590 --> 00:31:34,739 So three interviews. The first one looked baby kids and early life. 260 00:31:34,740 --> 00:31:39,420 So we tried to adopt broadly chronological schema. 261 00:31:40,710 --> 00:31:45,010 Example Questions 31 What is your earliest memory? 262 00:31:45,030 --> 00:31:56,670 Do you have concepts of God or high power? Some really interesting responses that one and it's easy to think we moved on to school or teenage years. 263 00:31:57,450 --> 00:32:02,490 We asked about education and then start asking about crime turning points in the interview. 264 00:32:03,270 --> 00:32:08,129 And the third interview was about more broad, abstract themes. 265 00:32:08,130 --> 00:32:11,580 And this is why we use the photo elicitation techniques. 266 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:20,340 So there are a couple of examples of the photographs they used to get the participants to talk about what they thought about these images, 267 00:32:20,340 --> 00:32:29,550 whether they recognised them, that they knew the individuals in them and what it represents, what they connected with and saw and sense. 268 00:32:30,510 --> 00:32:37,200 And within this interview, we get into that asking them whether they felt part of British Sex British Society. 269 00:32:38,670 --> 00:32:47,969 We asked them about regrets and also allowed them the opportunity to put in place that we hadn't actually covered their oppression. 270 00:32:47,970 --> 00:32:52,970 So we asked them, by the way, what they left and out of their life story. 271 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:59,310 And we also used this credit to capture some of the large events such as in school. 272 00:33:01,710 --> 00:33:09,950 So let's move on now to a couple of examples of the young people that we talk to. 273 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:14,460 So I gave my SO to him. 274 00:33:14,470 --> 00:33:21,450 So Mike was 25 years old, black, African, white, French, Muslim. 275 00:33:21,690 --> 00:33:25,870 He was born in an East London Patrick sisters. 276 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:30,839 And he's had quite a troubled, traumatic life. 277 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:36,120 His parents separated. He his father was then on the scene. 278 00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,990 And then he he found that particularly difficult. 279 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:50,850 And that that coincided with him being on a basketball team at school, but then was kicked off, which really affected him quite badly. 280 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:55,500 And it was at this point that he he began engaging in petty offending. 281 00:33:55,920 --> 00:34:08,040 He moved on to starting class. The drugs committed robbery, regularly using a real gun and also pretended to have a gun at times used knives, 282 00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,179 was physically attacked and victimised himself. 283 00:34:12,180 --> 00:34:20,820 So we really saw that overlap between offending victimisation quite often through our participants that it was really marked with 284 00:34:21,180 --> 00:34:34,380 Mike and then at 17 he became a father and he discussed how he started selling class-A drugs to make money so his daughter might. 285 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:43,020 This time we'd spoken had been in prison four times and most recently he was placed in a detention centre, 286 00:34:43,890 --> 00:34:47,490 had been deported to Paris and appealed his case, 287 00:34:47,490 --> 00:34:55,230 which he wants that he's going to talk back that in a way that why that was particularly poignant in his last story. 288 00:34:56,140 --> 00:35:06,570 And now Mike was working at the gym over at an organisation called Fight for Peace, which is a really interesting organisation. 289 00:35:06,570 --> 00:35:10,890 It's it's based in Brazil, East London and Jamaica. 290 00:35:11,550 --> 00:35:16,500 And they use a theory of change to try and sell sports, 291 00:35:16,500 --> 00:35:24,360 to try and change and thought that he can't afford to pay back and still stay in Rochester prison. 292 00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:30,810 And Mike told me that follows Islam privately along with lots of other issues. 293 00:35:32,340 --> 00:35:37,150 Then talk to you about. H So thank you. 294 00:35:37,170 --> 00:35:47,790 H was 22 years old when I interviewed him last summer and his mum was from The Gambia and he sat 295 00:35:47,790 --> 00:35:54,120 with Sierra Leoneans that his act was not part of his life growing up or indeed us as an adult. 296 00:35:54,600 --> 00:36:07,290 He was a devout Muslim and at the age of six he'd been sent by his mum to a religious school in Senegal, which he found deeply traumatic. 297 00:36:07,290 --> 00:36:19,370 He took family holidays just crying all day, but his mum and he doing right also experienced what he called abuse, beatings and torture. 298 00:36:19,380 --> 00:36:27,060 His time in this religious. And he only came back to London when he was 15 because he had malaria and it was 299 00:36:27,060 --> 00:36:33,120 recognised that he would have better sort of health outcomes and move back to the UK. 300 00:36:34,140 --> 00:36:39,959 So he came back to London, what he was doing. Unsurprisingly, he had quite a fraught relationship with his mother, 301 00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:49,290 who is described as unschooled and she was very strict binds, although he enrolled in college and learn English first hand. 302 00:36:49,290 --> 00:36:56,729 But he couldn't speak English. He hadn't been able to complete college for financial reasons, he said. 303 00:36:56,730 --> 00:37:02,130 But he was able in his last year to put money on things like the Cub Scouts College, 304 00:37:03,210 --> 00:37:06,570 and therefore he dropped out and he took quite wistfully about how, 305 00:37:06,570 --> 00:37:10,320 if that happened, happens, he would have been in your second or third year at university. 306 00:37:11,190 --> 00:37:19,799 So there was this breakdown of his relationship with his mother, and he was for a while to soak in and then commitment and so on. 307 00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:30,750 Seconds he had eyes with him was actually in a house that that was essentially a kind of small hostel accommodation through an organisation. 308 00:37:30,750 --> 00:37:41,190 So he was in a single room and I each have been involved in a variety of crime from the, you know, the less serious things. 309 00:37:41,190 --> 00:37:51,719 And although I would often we hear this argument that people are very rarely involved in offending for urgent subsistence needs, 310 00:37:51,720 --> 00:38:00,480 that seemed to be what I out. He describes being literally hungry, starving, unable to provide and food for himself, 311 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:09,329 particularly when he was living at home with his mum and his sisters and he'd been involved in that from his employer. 312 00:38:09,330 --> 00:38:14,370 First of all, he'd been employed at Wimbledon and somebody told him how you could make money out of it too. 313 00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:18,720 So that lasted about four days before he got caught. And that ended in a. 314 00:38:20,370 --> 00:38:28,020 And then he moved on to work in one of the catering outlets at Wembley Stadium, where he also took money out. 315 00:38:28,170 --> 00:38:32,399 So that job lasted for about a year. 316 00:38:32,400 --> 00:38:38,100 And then he he wasn't caught for that offending, but he changed jobs. 317 00:38:38,700 --> 00:38:40,409 And he'd also been involved. 318 00:38:40,410 --> 00:38:51,000 He'd been arrested for a violent so after he'd been robbed by an acquaintance that had ended in him attacking the perpetrator. 319 00:38:51,390 --> 00:38:58,230 But was that we found a place for them wasn't a fight. And he'd also been involved for about a year in getting in. 320 00:38:58,230 --> 00:39:04,740 And this is quite a tricky area for him as a devout Muslim, talking about the importance of morality. 321 00:39:04,740 --> 00:39:08,580 And this time and this will offset a bit more about this at the moment. 322 00:39:08,580 --> 00:39:13,409 But this was a difficult time when he felt he got sucked into offending. 323 00:39:13,410 --> 00:39:18,780 And again but again, he emphasised just the complete absence of money. 324 00:39:18,780 --> 00:39:21,479 And this was a, I think, violence of intrigue. 325 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:30,600 I'll speak to that balancing, for example, and designer items and to be able to kind of exhibit sort of materialist consumerism. 326 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:34,089 This really wasn't didn't appear to be the experience of H. 327 00:39:34,090 --> 00:39:42,329 She didn't present in that kind of way. He took about literally having no money and it looks like being arrested can wait outside. 328 00:39:42,330 --> 00:39:45,870 But more about his employment difficulties in the moment. 329 00:39:45,870 --> 00:39:48,120 But one of the things that was really interesting about him, 330 00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:56,339 he it was one of those interviews you do where you imagine that you might not you might not be able to kind of gain a rapport with somebody. 331 00:39:56,340 --> 00:40:00,030 So he was very he wasn't very forthcoming at the start. 332 00:40:00,030 --> 00:40:04,670 Things you haven't really sort of understood what was going on until recently, 333 00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:09,809 talked about his experiences in Central and the violence, the one that you see the experience. 334 00:40:09,810 --> 00:40:16,379 And he started to cry and he was he sighs, laugh throughout the interviews. 335 00:40:16,380 --> 00:40:21,459 And although I, of course, asked him whether he wanted to just stop the interview, 336 00:40:21,460 --> 00:40:27,480 if he wants to carry on, and he saw that as in a way spreading material back backlash cathartic, 337 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:37,650 he recognised that that's often a hugely traumatic part of his life and he tried to see that as a as a way of recognising his own inner strength. 338 00:40:38,070 --> 00:40:43,440 And he talked very positively about trying to move on with his life. 339 00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:51,899 He wanted to be successful, but he kind of demonstrated somewhat ironic from a very kind of Protestant work ethic. 340 00:40:51,900 --> 00:40:53,700 He was very keen to be employed. 341 00:40:56,520 --> 00:41:03,420 So we want to come on to talk about what some thought like to show you in relation to this idea of a sort of racialized world view. 342 00:41:04,170 --> 00:41:12,090 And this came out very clearly in years interview, where he talks, perhaps unsurprisingly, 343 00:41:12,090 --> 00:41:18,960 about the way in which stereotyping in East London influenced him and people like him. 344 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:26,370 So sorry. And that's just the of that actually, trust me from which you use that word all the way through the interviews, 345 00:41:26,370 --> 00:41:33,270 he talks about being working in construction as a labourer and Spain asks, What are you doing here? 346 00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:37,320 He says, I said, I'm working. They said that you black boys don't work. 347 00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:42,660 You're always outside the streets. He said, Fine, but that's not me. 348 00:41:42,780 --> 00:41:51,929 I'm working. And then not quite in these talks about what it was like to be a black boy in London in this country. 349 00:41:51,930 --> 00:41:55,799 Of course, you haven't grown up in this country. But he recognised it. 350 00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:59,760 His experience from 15 onwards that things are tight. 351 00:41:59,970 --> 00:42:01,980 You can't get job, 352 00:42:02,630 --> 00:42:10,080 contract job people giving you stereotypes because of the way you look or because of your hair or the way you dress or the way you talk. 353 00:42:11,010 --> 00:42:15,990 No, I'm saying it's like you can't be normal with normal people because they don't see you as normal. 354 00:42:16,470 --> 00:42:23,550 And I think that sense of being the mother, which, you know, at one level is very, very obvious, 355 00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:29,100 but actually was just really powerful in many of these incidents that he was invited 356 00:42:29,100 --> 00:42:34,470 into the sense of just not being seen as a normal young man trying to succeed. 357 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:45,600 He also talks about the system and he gave one example, which I think nicely shows the overlap between these kind of precarious employment. 358 00:42:46,020 --> 00:42:50,750 So this wasn't just about race. So he said sometimes a system locks. 359 00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:54,750 Sure. As well. So he talks about this topic applied for. 360 00:42:55,860 --> 00:42:59,490 He went there on Friday. He did one day's work. He got £64 for it. 361 00:42:59,730 --> 00:43:06,330 Then the next day he was like Thursday. And I gave him double what he earned for one day for working four days. 362 00:43:06,540 --> 00:43:16,499 And he got into a kind of altercation with the administrator who was managing the wages and the factory that was ongoing. 363 00:43:16,500 --> 00:43:18,739 While he was while we were talking, 364 00:43:18,740 --> 00:43:26,670 he had to make a phone call to try and ensure that he was going to be able to access the money so that he would get shots out. 365 00:43:26,670 --> 00:43:34,559 That was the right kind of action of the evening. So having had this experience essentially been exploited, 366 00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:42,150 it's perhaps because of these rights that certainly because of his vulnerable position and this kind of secondary labour market, 367 00:43:42,510 --> 00:43:49,500 he recognised that he needed to organise, get in housing benefit and you also need to leave to immediately look for another job. 368 00:43:49,740 --> 00:43:54,990 It assumes to have a longer term position, but he's only really been asked to work for a week. 369 00:43:56,070 --> 00:44:04,950 So he got up early to go to meet somebody at the employment centre and actually also an organisation 370 00:44:04,950 --> 00:44:12,059 that had been helping him in employment was supporting him and he was running a bit late. 371 00:44:12,060 --> 00:44:19,170 So he ended up at the Olympic Park in Stratford and he realised that that park, the park between the dock and his space, 372 00:44:19,170 --> 00:44:24,060 Google Maps showing that he needed to go through the park, that this area being cordoned off. 373 00:44:24,390 --> 00:44:30,330 So he went up to the security staff and asked whether they would let him go through this area that we pulled it off. 374 00:44:31,350 --> 00:44:34,409 And he said, today, I'm going to you. 375 00:44:34,410 --> 00:44:37,680 Can you just help me go through? You can even search me. 376 00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:40,140 I have nothing. I just need security because I'm running late. 377 00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:49,600 And he was aware that that, you know, it's time limited his opportunity to see this woman that would be happening stepped up and then he ran. 378 00:44:49,620 --> 00:44:54,699 When they when the security staff said that they want to let him in, let him go through this area, 379 00:44:54,700 --> 00:45:01,439 he went to another part of the park and they saw him jump over a bridge and he started to walk away. 380 00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:03,690 And then the number of security guards ran. 381 00:45:03,990 --> 00:45:14,550 They got security manager to come and the security manager asked him his name and then at the same time was ringing the police. 382 00:45:15,510 --> 00:45:21,270 So the way in which I can talk about this, the way in which he understood the situation, was that he asked nicely. 383 00:45:21,810 --> 00:45:25,620 It seems reasonable to be able to get to this place, 384 00:45:25,620 --> 00:45:33,360 and what was really significant was this kind of exasperation in that he couldn't communicate just how important this was as the back story of, 385 00:45:34,230 --> 00:45:41,670 you know, losing the job, being underpaid, needing to get to see this woman get another job, hopefully some patch of work. 386 00:45:42,270 --> 00:45:45,660 And then we've just being 48 by the security guards. 387 00:45:45,990 --> 00:45:50,639 And he talks about trying to be humble. And also, this is my life. 388 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:54,840 That's the thing that he was underlining. This is what life is like for people like me. 389 00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:59,549 And he's trying to be humble, but things like that. I can't take it. 390 00:45:59,550 --> 00:46:02,670 You're trying to make you just love stereotypes. You're giving me life. 391 00:46:02,670 --> 00:46:06,060 You're taking my name. We're giving it to the place where it's not needed. 392 00:46:06,330 --> 00:46:10,139 It doesn't matter how much you talk, how much you fight. It doesn't matter what you do. 393 00:46:10,140 --> 00:46:22,690 They always win. And just so it doesn't look like we've cherry picked just a really small part of the picture, 394 00:46:22,690 --> 00:46:27,760 give a small sample of it just included here, not quite by Tyrone, 395 00:46:28,690 --> 00:46:39,340 a young man who I interviewed as well, who talks about his experiences struggling and again, not actually Paris employment, but low wage employment. 396 00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:44,589 He had a permanent position working as a lift engineer and he talks about trailing 397 00:46:44,590 --> 00:46:49,720 off a colleague who started after him who had then been promoted before him. 398 00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:53,830 Now, of course, in any of this, we want to underline again, 399 00:46:54,100 --> 00:46:59,040 we're talking about the sections of discrimination, and that's the way in which this is interpreted. 400 00:46:59,050 --> 00:47:03,910 And I think certainly I'll find this in my research form in talking to young people in prison, 401 00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:12,880 is that actually people don't automatically assume that they've been victims of racism and discrimination. 402 00:47:13,270 --> 00:47:20,260 They look for strong explanations. And they're also, generally speaking, kind of reluctant to assume racism. 403 00:47:20,350 --> 00:47:26,049 So these white people that were trying to explain away their experiences, 404 00:47:26,050 --> 00:47:34,480 they were talking about the likelihood that these were actions, experiences, events of their lives to my sex life, discrimination. 405 00:47:35,560 --> 00:47:43,300 And so I was just talking about this ridiculous situation where he was much more skilled, that he'd been promoted by. 406 00:47:43,510 --> 00:47:52,479 He'd been the person who was less skilled, have been promoted over him in relation to experiences that he's seen. 407 00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:59,230 This quote would be very familiar to everybody here. I'm sure you're aware of lots of research which talks about the way in which 408 00:47:59,230 --> 00:48:04,750 people's lives are often mired in this ever present threat of police interrogation. 409 00:48:05,050 --> 00:48:11,920 In this case, that means that when your sister just had a baby and she sent Max that paint brush back and he's been 410 00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:19,810 stopped by what he called times covered plainclothes officers who actually put their hands in his trousers. 411 00:48:21,670 --> 00:48:27,220 They said that it looked like he was selling drugs and he'd just been out foraging, snatching bikes. 412 00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:28,510 Get to the shops they kept. 413 00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:41,600 In another instance, Jack, who'd had two periods in custody for violent offences, took that experience that he had ten years ago. 414 00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:49,190 And he said and I think we probably, you know, again, it seems very obvious, 415 00:48:49,190 --> 00:48:54,469 but I think it's quite important to underline that this idea of a racialized worldview is that the 416 00:48:54,470 --> 00:48:59,990 young people we spoke to expected discrimination and they expected it certainly from the place. 417 00:48:59,990 --> 00:49:03,950 Their place largely is not legitimate. 418 00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:08,840 So he said at the time, I just knew place like that. It was just like that. 419 00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:14,000 He thought of trying down to Essex with the friends, with his friends who knew some Chinese. 420 00:49:14,870 --> 00:49:20,749 And he said, you know, thinking about the way in which the police saw this, it's a white man and black guy. 421 00:49:20,750 --> 00:49:24,440 They look like some white man having some of them. 422 00:49:25,580 --> 00:49:28,640 And so the police are going to assume that we're the ones who attacked him. 423 00:49:28,790 --> 00:49:31,579 And in a sense, they did. But that's not the case. 424 00:49:31,580 --> 00:49:39,230 He said, even though he admitted to calling me a [INAUDIBLE], which even ten years ago would have constituted a racist incident, 425 00:49:39,410 --> 00:49:46,040 possibly a racially motivated crime, he admitted to put his hands on me first. 426 00:49:46,070 --> 00:49:49,130 I was the one still arrested. The white man was arrested. 427 00:49:50,420 --> 00:49:56,270 It doesn't make sense why he arrested me. The man admitted to police, put his hands on me so. 428 00:49:56,270 --> 00:49:58,350 And then he goes on to talk about what happened. 429 00:49:58,370 --> 00:50:05,660 They get they get off the train and he hears the white guy saying something and they hear some let me go. 430 00:50:06,110 --> 00:50:10,099 So he admits, you know, in his own account, I'm 15. 431 00:50:10,100 --> 00:50:14,600 I'm not smart. I'm not smart. So don't expect me to walk away. 432 00:50:14,810 --> 00:50:19,660 Don't even run one by me on small and some less. 433 00:50:19,660 --> 00:50:22,940 But that's one side. I still have their eyes off this man. 434 00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:31,370 Why? He said what he said. And the guy said to me, If you're going to do something, do something, and that's it. 435 00:50:31,370 --> 00:50:35,770 Not going to do something. Do something nice to the dog that's in my throat. 436 00:50:35,780 --> 00:50:39,290 And at that point, he and his friends in statements. 437 00:50:42,860 --> 00:50:54,200 And this one was interesting because Tyrone was one of our respondents who was often seen as reluctant to talk about racial discrimination. 438 00:50:56,000 --> 00:51:02,810 And it was interesting that the young woman that we interviewed to do that at the time was actually hiring his partner. 439 00:51:03,110 --> 00:51:09,020 And she talked about things that they experienced that he didn't talk about in his interview. 440 00:51:09,710 --> 00:51:12,980 But he talks about time in jail for his staff has been arrested. 441 00:51:13,190 --> 00:51:16,790 And I asked him about, you know, how do you been involved in crime? 442 00:51:17,090 --> 00:51:25,610 He said as far as he knew, they happened throughout his life. He hadn't you know, he wasn't an offender and the police had turned up to the house. 443 00:51:25,610 --> 00:51:32,810 And so I rang and said, excited by the car with the lights on and the speeding and said to the police officers, 444 00:51:33,980 --> 00:51:37,160 Come, I got with him, my dad in the police car and they say, yes. 445 00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:41,209 And, you know, this was, I think, very poignant in the interview. 446 00:51:41,210 --> 00:51:44,810 He said, oh, you will one day. And he took that. 447 00:51:44,810 --> 00:51:48,049 He said he didn't understand. He's taken that as a positive thing. 448 00:51:48,050 --> 00:51:50,240 He said he had to ride in a big stop. 449 00:51:50,870 --> 00:52:00,350 But of course, later he realised that his staff had been struggling perhaps perhaps by his leg during that back to back that incident. 450 00:52:00,950 --> 00:52:08,630 So again, it's about trying to recognise, I think, the pervasiveness of these kinds of experiences for these young men. 451 00:52:10,580 --> 00:52:16,010 And then the final one, Joseph was somebody that we institute haven't been involved in crime. 452 00:52:16,940 --> 00:52:25,610 He had one incident, why he'd been suspected of being involved in stealing funds from a mobile phone shop in Westfield in Stratford. 453 00:52:26,450 --> 00:52:31,459 And interestingly, he took that had been treated really kindly by the security office. 454 00:52:31,460 --> 00:52:35,540 It'd be really embarrassing then. So walk through Westfield. 455 00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:42,079 But he'd said that he'd been treated very kindly. And then there was this kind of, sort of embarrassment, 456 00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:50,690 like security officer saw the Bible in Jesus bag and actually recognised that he was a very devout Christian. 457 00:52:51,560 --> 00:53:01,549 But what he did talk about again was the sense in which black young people are much more vulnerable to exclusion and discrimination, 458 00:53:01,550 --> 00:53:06,830 and they resist inequality and experience in these white dominated institutions. 459 00:53:06,830 --> 00:53:10,910 He took black friends who hadn't been able to continue going to sixth form. 460 00:53:12,110 --> 00:53:15,080 He hadn't really done anything wrong, but he got kicked out. 461 00:53:15,530 --> 00:53:21,919 And like many of the others, I'm not saying it's racism, but most people that are doing bad stuff in school were white, 462 00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:28,190 that they were kicking out black people for things that appeared to be much less major in terms of that seriousness. 463 00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:34,280 Okay. So finish up talking about Mike. 464 00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:38,150 How long ago? Not very long at all. 465 00:53:39,230 --> 00:53:43,900 5 minutes. Yeah. 466 00:53:44,090 --> 00:53:48,980 So I have to have my two. I have to use you earlier. 467 00:53:49,670 --> 00:53:57,830 So just to give you a second to read what what Mike is saying to me in this in this first interview. 468 00:53:58,490 --> 00:54:05,420 So, as you can probably tell. Mike's actually struggling to tell me about his ethnic background and his nationality. 469 00:54:05,870 --> 00:54:12,560 So I asked him how he looks at the country that you and your family came from, which makes the fact that who you are. 470 00:54:13,010 --> 00:54:21,520 And as this interaction goes on, Mike gets quite agitated, he's reflective and he's always aggressive, you know. 471 00:54:21,530 --> 00:54:26,480 So he says, okay, I'm just, you know, I'm neo abstract from when I was young. 472 00:54:27,050 --> 00:54:32,150 I'm just from that and then progresses to saying just because I'm from France like I'm not. 473 00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:38,569 KING Which kind of stood out to me and he kept emphasising that it's not important. 474 00:54:38,570 --> 00:54:47,180 It's not important. But so and this was in the first interview, so it was very much before he told me that he'd been deported. 475 00:54:48,080 --> 00:54:54,140 So it's really clear biases. And in contrast to the examples that strategists talk about, 476 00:54:55,130 --> 00:55:00,340 I think this is a more subtle way in which Mike's racialized worldview is actually coming out. 477 00:55:00,350 --> 00:55:05,870 So it's through nationality, but Mike is really feeling racialized. 478 00:55:07,370 --> 00:55:10,760 Another example as well with Mike. 479 00:55:12,290 --> 00:55:17,510 So I'm asking him whether he thinks there's much racial prejudice nowadays. 480 00:55:17,870 --> 00:55:19,719 And a young prosecutor says, of course, 481 00:55:19,720 --> 00:55:30,590 the race and he he really emphasise this how he feels that faith in and the subtle ways in which it's it's felt. 482 00:55:30,620 --> 00:55:34,399 So it's not necessarily sad but felt so at the bottom of the society, 483 00:55:34,400 --> 00:55:39,470 say because people are racial, they won't say it to you that they have racial cause. 484 00:55:39,980 --> 00:55:48,140 So and that's the glass. So he found that particularly painful, actually, the way in which he felt racism, even life wasn't explicit. 485 00:55:52,270 --> 00:55:59,350 Another example of MIT's racialized worldview came out in his discussions of the criminal justice system. 486 00:55:59,830 --> 00:56:08,470 So I think this is the vignette piece asked him to apply, see whether he felt that the police would treat him or other races better. 487 00:56:08,950 --> 00:56:16,540 And he says all that cheating less. I mean, he again draws on the idea that it would be because of stereotypes automatically. 488 00:56:17,410 --> 00:56:21,180 And then immediately he refers to a case that happens. 489 00:56:21,190 --> 00:56:26,169 It is not clear yet why he says that as a muslim boy he would say to the mosque and 490 00:56:26,170 --> 00:56:31,479 he was arrested because he was wearing too many layers and research by uniform. 491 00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:39,910 Gaffigan has also shown this how the mysterious consequences have have problematic those 492 00:56:39,910 --> 00:56:46,059 consequences of racial discrimination are and they can really manifest themselves. 493 00:56:46,060 --> 00:56:50,220 Even when that stopped through my first experience, 494 00:56:50,230 --> 00:56:59,310 so often the young people refer to their friends being stopped and searched and then actually feeling, feeling the pain and problems of that. 495 00:57:02,890 --> 00:57:07,990 The photograph on the slide is from a flat photo elicitation case. 496 00:57:08,500 --> 00:57:15,700 So I asked Mike about his thoughts on that and obviously saying that's really bad and he's restrained. 497 00:57:15,700 --> 00:57:22,599 And again, it to his own experiences and this this stagecraft really works quite well because in contrast, 498 00:57:22,600 --> 00:57:30,879 I have a young white participants who who looked at that photograph and said to me, Yeah, you know, look how many people are checking. 499 00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:39,760 That man is really badly hurt. And, you know, the contrast in the way in which these situations see the streets, how nice. 500 00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:45,250 Quite shocked that he he did actually really believe that that the police were just checking this man. 501 00:57:45,280 --> 00:57:49,210 In contrast, obviously, to some whites perspective. 502 00:57:51,870 --> 00:58:01,439 And again, to underscore what my thoughts were about the place, he he had really negative views of the place. 503 00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:04,200 He felt as though they they abuse their power. 504 00:58:05,070 --> 00:58:12,030 And he makes a clear distinction between how he sees the law on principle, but also compared to how it's actually applied. 505 00:58:12,750 --> 00:58:16,620 And a number of my interviews were actually conducted very soon after they were shown. 506 00:58:16,620 --> 00:58:19,840 Charles Case in London. 507 00:58:19,860 --> 00:58:22,140 Some of the people said that they knew him. 508 00:58:22,500 --> 00:58:31,770 Rashawn Charles, for those, if you don't mind, died at the hands of the police last I think it's July, maybe, maybe June that July. 509 00:58:32,850 --> 00:58:41,490 So again, this this really strong sense in which he sees the police as is loving to use that power that's the enough to do. 510 00:58:46,010 --> 00:58:49,900 Finds another example of mice racialise welfare. 511 00:58:49,910 --> 00:58:54,620 So he is really always keen to go beyond just the name describing things. 512 00:58:54,620 --> 00:59:01,760 So he showed young people these pictures, these photographs, and this is in the case of Lee Rigby. 513 00:59:02,330 --> 00:59:09,980 And he really explained the need to go beyond the surface, to understand the case, to explore the motivations of the perpetrators. 514 00:59:10,310 --> 00:59:13,970 And he firmly locates the explanation within a racial framework. 515 00:59:14,300 --> 00:59:20,690 So racial how it's understood racial bias, Don says, with this key, key phrase. 516 00:59:22,430 --> 00:59:29,750 And similarly with the with the racist graffiti photograph, he says he expects it. 517 00:59:29,780 --> 00:59:36,890 He thinks that that's the normal mode of transaction between him and white groups in the area where he lives. 518 00:59:38,870 --> 00:59:44,989 And again, he refers back to the place he says that needs to go will change it to the place again. 519 00:59:44,990 --> 01:00:00,630 Which is to say. And so what we what we're trying to do is to really show how interpersonal racial discrimination, along with structural racism, 520 01:00:01,110 --> 01:00:08,910 is antagonistic, stressful, cumulative in its impact and on the potential to increase the risk of offending. 521 01:00:09,390 --> 01:00:16,200 So with this scope, we see such hate. She feels that he has little less of a choice and he's stuck. 522 01:00:16,320 --> 01:00:20,580 He's fixed by the stereotypes attributed to him, by the system. 523 01:00:20,850 --> 01:00:24,960 And he sees this as applying to to black people more broadly. 524 01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:36,790 Again, coming back to Mike, this was a discussion that he that came up for me to talk about turning points in life. 525 01:00:37,140 --> 01:00:41,440 And at this point, he reveals to me about his experience in detention. 526 01:00:41,980 --> 01:00:49,120 He said it was sad, traumatised, so traumatising that it caused the problems and drew him into drug dealing drugs again. 527 01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:54,470 So the experience of detention hurt him and made to smash everything up. 528 01:00:54,490 --> 01:00:57,760 So he says it not only just made him think about smashing things up, 529 01:00:57,760 --> 01:01:04,690 but actually might have made him physically want to do that and going back to use of colours and fonts. 530 01:01:04,690 --> 01:01:14,020 They also suggest how racial discrimination fractures the ability of African-Americans to qualify for historically white dominated institutions. 531 01:01:14,770 --> 01:01:20,450 And what happens is they come to perceive these institutions as persistently discriminated against. 532 01:01:20,480 --> 01:01:25,030 And also this other research that again, based in the US, 533 01:01:25,030 --> 01:01:34,570 which shows empirically that exposure to racial discrimination is really a strong risk factor of more violence. 534 01:01:36,610 --> 01:01:41,560 So they found that a sample of African-Americans age 6 to 22, 32, 535 01:01:42,310 --> 01:01:47,860 that responded to a report about having been a victim of at least one of six types of 536 01:01:47,860 --> 01:01:53,140 racial discrimination were more likely to than have an official recourse to violence. 537 01:01:57,260 --> 01:02:01,820 And they'll come on to conclude just a few points here. 538 01:02:02,600 --> 01:02:09,280 So although we've we've really we really feel that life histories have been successful, 539 01:02:09,290 --> 01:02:14,000 they've been a great way in which to understand these these intricate processes. 540 01:02:14,570 --> 01:02:21,260 We also reflect on the fact that there are only eight points of access to the connections between funding, 541 01:02:21,260 --> 01:02:24,290 race and structural factors and cultural identity. 542 01:02:24,920 --> 01:02:30,800 So the lives that people talk and the lives they all live are not the same thing. 543 01:02:32,060 --> 01:02:36,590 And much of life, of course, we appreciate actually has beyond the research just. 544 01:02:37,640 --> 01:02:45,140 So in some sense, we did get the sense that the core of life is at times unreachable that life's actually 545 01:02:45,140 --> 01:02:50,540 do is telling the times that which we really have to drag out the information. 546 01:02:51,020 --> 01:02:58,820 Despite our best efforts to try and introduce chronology, we find that people start from presence parks and vice versa. 547 01:02:59,330 --> 01:03:04,970 But I think it's important to see the merits and limitations of the approach. 548 01:03:06,530 --> 01:03:13,700 And I think so the argument is why whilst we can't categorically provide a causal link between discrimination, 549 01:03:13,700 --> 01:03:19,700 racism and funding, but we have really strong indications of that in our data. 550 01:03:20,390 --> 01:03:23,600 And so the findings along with that, 551 01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:30,889 and that's how really underlined the functional premise we think of considering 552 01:03:30,890 --> 01:03:35,840 the influence of race and racism from from a micro sociological perspective. 553 01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:46,970 And lastly, to conclude, we wonder what the best crime reduction potential from a broad anti-racist movement. 554 01:03:47,450 --> 01:03:53,389 We think it's really telling that much of the US research on the effects of racial discrimination 555 01:03:53,390 --> 01:04:00,590 on funding is actually funded under the auspices of public health funded public health paradigms. 556 01:04:00,890 --> 01:04:05,180 So lots of the research is funded by mental health funders. 557 01:04:05,870 --> 01:04:11,209 And this this seems yet to be fully integrate sweeping in British criminology. 558 01:04:11,210 --> 01:04:20,060 But it's really interesting that that's where this research linking racial discrimination and funding lives in the US. 559 01:04:21,730 --> 01:04:30,970 Thank you. I.