1 00:00:00,030 --> 00:00:02,759 Well, thanks. Thank you, everybody, for that introduction. That saves me having to do it myself. 2 00:00:02,760 --> 00:00:09,419 And it should be about marketers job to self-promote I think and you've heard a lot from the introduction there 3 00:00:09,420 --> 00:00:14,040 about about retailing now I think there's only actually one retail example and what I want to say this evening, 4 00:00:14,040 --> 00:00:17,549 because some of you may have been thinking, well, if this guy just knows about retailing, 5 00:00:17,550 --> 00:00:21,180 why am I here listening to him talking about small, firm marketing? 6 00:00:21,990 --> 00:00:25,979 And it's particularly important that we distinguish between the kinds of marketing 7 00:00:25,980 --> 00:00:29,639 that certainly I cut my teeth on in working for Coca-Cola and for Tesco, 8 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:36,090 which was the marketing undertaken by very large organisations, particularly consumer facing organisations, 9 00:00:36,420 --> 00:00:44,250 and the kind of marketing that you might be involved in in your own businesses, particularly business to business, business service firms, 10 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:52,710 small science, technology, start ups, the kinds of organisations that we see from the kinds of incubator activity that we have across the university. 11 00:00:53,250 --> 00:00:58,379 So although I will, I think refer to certainly one I think retailer we want to talk about this evening, 12 00:00:58,380 --> 00:01:06,270 it's very much around the kinds of marketing challenges that face small and medium sized enterprises and how they might be overcome. 13 00:01:07,140 --> 00:01:12,360 Now, one of my first, I think, lessons is about clear communication to someone coming from the back. 14 00:01:13,020 --> 00:01:16,889 I can't see that very well because it's it's turquoise on grey. 15 00:01:16,890 --> 00:01:21,299 Okay. So those of you that are a bit worried about that, the rest of the slides are actually reversed. 16 00:01:21,300 --> 00:01:23,880 So you able to see them quite well, I hope, as we go through. 17 00:01:24,570 --> 00:01:31,650 Now, let me start by just reminding us, of course, that marketing can be a very persuasive activity. 18 00:01:31,770 --> 00:01:35,250 And I want to show you a couple of examples of that to kick us off. 19 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:47,710 Some people think the Internet is a good thing the most powerful educational tool the world has ever known. 20 00:01:50,170 --> 00:01:55,960 It's preserving our history, making sure that in the future we never forget the past. 21 00:01:57,730 --> 00:02:06,640 When disaster struck Asia, the volume of aid donated by ordinary people through websites outweighed that of their own governments. 22 00:02:08,230 --> 00:02:14,110 The Internet is a place that is free of state regulation, censorship and control. 23 00:02:15,570 --> 00:02:19,620 The only place where freedom of speech truly exists. 24 00:02:20,370 --> 00:02:24,680 Orwell was wrong. It is not the state that holds all the power. 25 00:02:26,150 --> 00:02:31,850 It is us. Some people think the internet is a good thing. 26 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:39,920 What do you think? There's a classic piece of persuasive marketing. 27 00:02:39,920 --> 00:02:44,390 Are you persuaded that the Internet is a good thing, or do you feel perhaps the reverse? 28 00:02:46,070 --> 00:02:48,630 Some people think the Internet is a bad thing. 29 00:02:49,550 --> 00:02:57,080 Some way your identity can be stolen, your home invaded, and your savings robbed without anyone setting foot inside your door. 30 00:02:57,950 --> 00:03:01,160 It is one of the most dangerous weapons ever created. 31 00:03:02,390 --> 00:03:05,450 A way for the unhinged to spread evil. 32 00:03:05,630 --> 00:03:10,670 Free of supervision or censorship. A place for mankind. 33 00:03:10,820 --> 00:03:19,010 To exercise its darkest desires. An open market where you can purchase anything you want. 34 00:03:21,860 --> 00:03:32,210 Orwell was right. The Internet has taken us to a place where everything we do is watched, monitored and processed without us realising. 35 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:39,730 Some people think the Internet is a bad. What do you think? 36 00:03:43,340 --> 00:03:49,970 So here we have the creative talents. You can imagine the three in the basement working out how to do this and create a good out in a bad ad. 37 00:03:50,450 --> 00:03:57,330 But it shows the creative talents of marketers and advertisers. Set to a purpose to create a value proposition. 38 00:03:57,630 --> 00:04:01,490 And that value proposition in this case can either be the Internet is a good thing or it's a bad thing. 39 00:04:01,500 --> 00:04:04,620 In this case, they're putting it side by side and asking you to decide. 40 00:04:05,130 --> 00:04:10,650 But actually, from my point of view, the creativity and the skill that's going to that is largely irrelevant. 41 00:04:11,070 --> 00:04:16,889 What really matters is, does it work? Has it sold more AOL subscriptions or more egalite? 42 00:04:16,890 --> 00:04:22,830 If you have spotted that these were both ads for AOL, anyone use AOL on a regular basis? 43 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:28,450 Oh. Oh, dear. All right. 44 00:04:28,450 --> 00:04:35,590 We'll speak to you later about transferring your account. But, you know, it has to be to an effect. 45 00:04:36,190 --> 00:04:39,280 Fantastic advertising, really compelling, really interesting. 46 00:04:39,490 --> 00:04:44,770 We could deconstruct that 4 hours to see how they did it with the music, the tone, the imagery and so on. 47 00:04:45,100 --> 00:04:49,180 But did it work? Did it actually build market share for AOL? 48 00:04:50,020 --> 00:04:57,040 Well, actually, no. 1 billion losses in one quarter, the second quarter of the year this year. 49 00:04:58,030 --> 00:05:02,890 And the nice thing here is AOL. Yahoo! Doesn't impress alone altogether. 50 00:05:03,220 --> 00:05:09,790 You might have missed it, but the two nineties brands that keep sputtering along in spite of themselves made some big announcements last week. 51 00:05:10,060 --> 00:05:13,210 There's even talk of them possibly emerging as anybody really care. 52 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:21,640 So, okay, so all the good marketing in the world cannot help a dove value proposition. 53 00:05:21,970 --> 00:05:29,230 Okay, so there's nothing at the heart of what you're trying to market to a customer base, then frankly, it's not worth bothering. 54 00:05:29,530 --> 00:05:32,770 And that has to come first. So what I want to do this evening. 55 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:38,800 I want to start off with some basic questions. What are the kinds of things that as a as a Start-Up, 56 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:46,480 as a small business you should be thinking about in terms of your marketing activity or the questions you'd ask yourselves? 57 00:05:47,410 --> 00:05:52,630 I also do think about what are the differences between marketing for companies like Coca-Cola and Tesco, 58 00:05:52,810 --> 00:05:56,290 companies I work with and a small organisation. 59 00:05:57,280 --> 00:06:01,359 What are the strengths that you can build upon within a small organisation? 60 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:07,300 Because there are a great many strengths that you can use to create an effective marketing strategy. 61 00:06:08,450 --> 00:06:11,780 And then we'll talk a bit about how to create and keep customers. 62 00:06:12,380 --> 00:06:15,920 And you'll see that talks about value creation and co-creation. 63 00:06:15,930 --> 00:06:20,990 Because one of the messages that I want to put across this evening is that marketing, 64 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:24,620 whether it's with large firms or small firms or particularly with small firms, 65 00:06:24,890 --> 00:06:33,590 it's about working hand in hand with your customers, not waiting until you've got your product or service finely honed and ready to ship. 66 00:06:34,130 --> 00:06:41,360 But actually right at the very early stages of the design process, right at the stage where you're thinking about, well, what is the need? 67 00:06:41,510 --> 00:06:48,560 Where's the gap? What need is my fulfilling in creating this wonderful device or this wonderful service? 68 00:06:48,860 --> 00:06:53,210 So that co-creation comes at the very heart of that process. 69 00:06:53,810 --> 00:06:58,100 So creating customers is about well, it's about getting known. 70 00:06:58,340 --> 00:07:04,310 It's about raising awareness. And small businesses have a hard time getting their heads above the parapet, 71 00:07:04,340 --> 00:07:11,720 actually standing out from the kind of white noise that surrounds us, particularly at the moment with, as we've seen, the growth of the Internet. 72 00:07:12,940 --> 00:07:21,550 But then reaching those customers, working with them and then keeping them and keeping them is not just about sending them things over six months, 73 00:07:21,850 --> 00:07:24,940 but it's about creating and sustaining relationships. 74 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:30,430 We hear a lot of rhetoric, a lot of hype about relationship marketing. 75 00:07:30,850 --> 00:07:37,780 I want to debunk some of that this evening, but I also want to give you some practical steps about how you might seek to 76 00:07:37,780 --> 00:07:42,609 keep in touch with those people who think what you're doing is interesting, 77 00:07:42,610 --> 00:07:49,980 worthwhile worth paying for. I will talk a bit about that as well and we'll talk a bit about delivering service quality. 78 00:07:49,990 --> 00:07:57,040 So maintaining customer inspection, retaining loyalty of your customers over time and delivering quality. 79 00:07:57,580 --> 00:08:04,610 And at the end, we'll perhaps share a bit of further reading material that you can look out to to build on your understanding. 80 00:08:04,610 --> 00:08:10,870 And that's AOL calling. I don't want to know if I can do something, but but basic questions. 81 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:16,660 We hear a lot about the value proposition. I think I've even heard about some of that so far on this program. 82 00:08:17,980 --> 00:08:24,969 From a marketing point of view, a value proposition, something that just falls out of the tree and lands in your lap, a value proposition, 83 00:08:24,970 --> 00:08:34,360 something you would have to work hard at creating and at defending and at arguing the case for who is it being created by? 84 00:08:34,750 --> 00:08:38,730 For whom? If it's been created for a certain group of customers? 85 00:08:39,150 --> 00:08:42,300 What are they going to value in it? How much they want to pay for it? 86 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:46,430 Where do they want to get it? How is that going to change over time? 87 00:08:47,470 --> 00:08:50,060 Because certainly if I think about something like this product, for example, 88 00:08:50,300 --> 00:08:55,400 you know, the value proposition is not necessarily about making phone calls. 89 00:08:55,910 --> 00:09:00,230 Okay. When this was first introduced, it was about saying, I've got this and you haven't. 90 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:03,440 Okay. It was about a status goal. Okay. 91 00:09:03,680 --> 00:09:08,839 It wasn't about the fact that he could make phone calls and indeed, the current version can't make very good phone calls. 92 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:13,670 Even now, the version for this thing, if you hold your thumb in a particular place. 93 00:09:14,330 --> 00:09:18,020 But it's certainly about creating a kind of value. 94 00:09:19,220 --> 00:09:24,860 And that value changed over time. It changed from, you know, something which was about, I've got this and you haven't. 95 00:09:25,340 --> 00:09:28,450 When I went home in the park and ride bus the other day, everyone had one of these. 96 00:09:28,460 --> 00:09:34,490 I'm saying, Well, so why have I got this? Why am I paying more for this than I could be paying for any other device? 97 00:09:34,940 --> 00:09:38,030 Well, perhaps there are some good functional reasons why I use this. 98 00:09:38,390 --> 00:09:40,340 Perhaps it's the the ease of use. 99 00:09:40,700 --> 00:09:46,879 Perhaps it's some of the design effort, which is quite nice, are now defending my purchase of this device rather than necessarily, 100 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:50,750 you know, making it clear that there's a value proposition. But it can change over time. 101 00:09:51,710 --> 00:09:55,890 So what's now become the status symbol of choice in this particular brand? 102 00:09:55,890 --> 00:10:00,500 The category is that. So you're just thinking about, well, how will this evolve over time? 103 00:10:00,890 --> 00:10:05,300 Because actually we don't know what the value proposition is for this at the moment. 104 00:10:06,290 --> 00:10:09,020 When this is first introduced, everyone says it's a bit large for a phone. 105 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:15,290 You know, when Steve Jobs sort of came on with this like this, you know, he didn't do that with it. 106 00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:23,660 But actually, they are going to fit this out with the next next version will have some phone capabilities. 107 00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:27,829 So we've got to think about the way the value proposition will evolve. 108 00:10:27,830 --> 00:10:33,620 And actually, in this case, it's the customers who are helping that value proposition evolve. 109 00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:42,580 But how do we keep for Apple? How do we keep these people buying this thing and not shifting to a cheaper alternative? 110 00:10:42,940 --> 00:10:47,150 How many of you have one of these? How many of you have a Kindle? 111 00:10:48,550 --> 00:10:52,129 How many of you want a Kindle for Christmas? How many are you going to get? 112 00:10:52,130 --> 00:10:57,110 One. Okay. Right. So, yeah, there are always cheaper alternatives. 113 00:10:57,140 --> 00:11:02,420 And as the ads will tell us, you know, the Kindle is the one where you're sitting next to the babe at the pool. 114 00:11:02,930 --> 00:11:07,910 That's the screen you can see. Whereas the geek with the iPad is try hard to see what's on the screen. 115 00:11:08,150 --> 00:11:12,560 So yeah, there are always competitive differences in relation to value propositions. 116 00:11:12,590 --> 00:11:18,770 So how are we going to retain our customers? And these questions apply to small firms as well as to large firms like Apple. 117 00:11:20,020 --> 00:11:23,740 The reverse of that is about capabilities as far as marketing is concerned. 118 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:28,890 What what experience, what capabilities do we have in marketing? 119 00:11:29,050 --> 00:11:32,770 Clearly the large organisation do not have a great many capabilities and smaller less so. 120 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:37,810 Secondly, can we set aside our own personal biases and preferences? 121 00:11:38,350 --> 00:11:41,829 One of the things about marketing is, you know, you leave your values at the door in a sense, 122 00:11:41,830 --> 00:11:47,710 because actually if you don't, then you start trying to market things that you want rather than your target market. 123 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:57,490 And thirdly, and most importantly, if you're spending money on things like Facebook pages or major twit Twitter campaigns or ads, 124 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:04,570 AOL, you know, are we seeing a return on our investment in terms of the payback from our marketing spend? 125 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:09,820 So those are basic questions that any organisation should be asking about its marketing activities. 126 00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:16,150 Now, if you buy a textbook on marketing and this is one of mine. Sorry, you'll see a diagram like this. 127 00:12:16,420 --> 00:12:22,060 Okay. The diagram will talk about understanding value. We'll talk about designing, communicating value or something similar. 128 00:12:22,610 --> 00:12:25,900 Look about maintaining it, which is all about loyalty and profit at the end of the line. 129 00:12:26,350 --> 00:12:34,060 But actually for a small organisation, as you'll see from already looking at your handout, you won't know you see it now. 130 00:12:34,570 --> 00:12:38,410 Actually, complex marketing theories may not be appropriate for small businesses, 131 00:12:38,410 --> 00:12:42,370 so you can throw away a lot of those textbooks, even mine, if you want to do that. 132 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:49,870 I know death row admonish you hang on to that because I can cite at the end of you have a much more valuable copy if you'd like to do that. 133 00:12:50,410 --> 00:12:55,390 But for small businesses, I think in some senses these are over complications. 134 00:12:56,410 --> 00:13:05,110 We should be asking some simple questions and taking some simple, practical steps to creating and reaching and maintaining our customer connections. 135 00:13:06,820 --> 00:13:08,410 Let's think about marketing as small firms, 136 00:13:08,650 --> 00:13:17,080 because although marketing theories might not be critical to the success of small firms and to market decision making, 137 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:22,570 actually marketing insight and marketing knowledge is. So knowing about your customer base. 138 00:13:23,470 --> 00:13:29,650 Having deep understanding of their needs, wants, desires, dreams, nightmares, preferences, 139 00:13:30,310 --> 00:13:34,150 dislikes is going to be absolutely critical to getting your proposition right. 140 00:13:35,020 --> 00:13:41,830 The problem is that, of course, most small businesses don't have that kind of expertise, don't have that kind of resource. 141 00:13:41,890 --> 00:13:47,030 If you think about it in a formal marketing sense. Indeed. 142 00:13:47,030 --> 00:13:54,490 When you look at the research on SMS and marketing and there's quite a lot of it around that through more research on surveys and marketing sometimes, 143 00:13:54,500 --> 00:13:57,650 and there is actually the marketing resource within the firm itself. 144 00:13:58,310 --> 00:14:04,040 What you find is that the owner managers who run many of these smaller enterprises are generalists, as we know. 145 00:14:04,700 --> 00:14:08,510 And actually, perhaps marketing is not one of the skills they may have picked up on. 146 00:14:09,610 --> 00:14:15,489 But often you find that for many SMEs you'll find that the consideration is marketing is a non-problem. 147 00:14:15,490 --> 00:14:18,640 Anyone can do that, anyone can sell, we'll get from them to do it. 148 00:14:19,930 --> 00:14:25,300 We'll leave it to sales. And they're quite sales marketing or they're quite marketing with advertising. 149 00:14:26,590 --> 00:14:33,940 But actually it's just advertising, isn't it? It's the personality of the boss who thinks that marketing is just advertising nothing else, 150 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:37,389 despite the fact that our political parties are demonstrated, you know, 151 00:14:37,390 --> 00:14:41,590 in the US and in Europe, that actually good marketing can achieve a great deal. 152 00:14:42,070 --> 00:14:47,470 It isn't just about advertising, it's about PR, personal presentation, lobbying, 153 00:14:47,980 --> 00:14:51,460 a whole range of activities that larger organisations get involved with. 154 00:14:53,060 --> 00:14:57,860 And for some, also an SMS marketing can just mean the full piece because I read that somewhere in a textbook. 155 00:14:58,310 --> 00:15:02,120 And if you don't remember the four piece, they are a price promotion place. 156 00:15:02,390 --> 00:15:04,680 And what's the other one? Thank you. 157 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:10,700 So everyone knows that for PS4, although there are actually five or six for anyone, which book you might want to read. 158 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:16,070 So you know know is the usual kind of dinner party conversation of choice. 159 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:24,260 So we have to get away from these sorts of attitudes about marketing because actually within SMEs, 160 00:15:24,260 --> 00:15:30,530 I would argue there is a great deal of resource and expertise and it's not recognised, it's not made explicit. 161 00:15:31,670 --> 00:15:37,170 The problem is if you think about marketing in a conventional way or think it's a non-problem or it's sales or 162 00:15:37,170 --> 00:15:43,760 it's advertising and you don't prioritise it at the right stage in the development of your product or service, 163 00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:47,750 your marketing is going to be pretty unplanned, is going to be spontaneous and haphazard. 164 00:15:48,690 --> 00:15:53,430 More importantly, though, it may be too late because we've already made the mousetrap. 165 00:15:53,610 --> 00:15:56,330 And you're worrying why no one is beating a path to your door. 166 00:15:57,430 --> 00:16:04,180 So there are some challenges around how an entrepreneur SMB will acquire marketing capability. 167 00:16:05,540 --> 00:16:11,209 But as I say, I think there are a number of things that SMEs have going for them that in some respects 168 00:16:11,210 --> 00:16:15,320 large organisations don't because they've lost touch with some of those aspects. 169 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:21,620 Well can we characterise the as having well pretty good personal contact networks. 170 00:16:22,070 --> 00:16:28,190 It's the nature of entrepreneurship to be social, to be networking, to be in touch. 171 00:16:28,790 --> 00:16:36,680 And those networks are not just people looking for funding, but the networks for ideas for potential customers or potential sales. 172 00:16:37,460 --> 00:16:43,070 So the network is an ideal place to start because they will know about your business, they will know about the market. 173 00:16:43,790 --> 00:16:45,860 We often hear discussion of the bandwidth. 174 00:16:45,870 --> 00:16:53,180 The market is basically the accumulation of all the networks operating in the marketplace and the relationships of that marketplace. 175 00:16:53,690 --> 00:17:01,580 But as a start of organisation, as an asset me, you are likely to have quite a tightly defined network of friends, investors, 176 00:17:01,790 --> 00:17:06,529 people who know about things that you're doing and can refer, you can recommend, 177 00:17:06,530 --> 00:17:10,640 you can talk about you to others using really very effective word of mouth. 178 00:17:11,710 --> 00:17:19,030 But that network can also help you guide your marketing decisions, and it could also help you with generating sales inquiries and contacts. 179 00:17:19,570 --> 00:17:31,280 So mind that network. Minded relentlessly and remorseless remorselessly, because actually that's the place we can start in generating a customer base. 180 00:17:32,380 --> 00:17:38,350 But there are also some competencies within the business that are made up of the kinds of people that start new firms. 181 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:44,230 What do we know about those people? We've heard over the last few weeks the nature of entrepreneurship. 182 00:17:44,890 --> 00:17:49,420 But actually, people that create firms are themselves often imaginative. 183 00:17:49,420 --> 00:17:55,719 Creative. They have vision. I actually have good standing skills because otherwise how would they be able to command the kind 184 00:17:55,720 --> 00:18:00,280 of investment in their organisation that they have been able to do to start the business up? 185 00:18:00,700 --> 00:18:04,670 So they have selling communication skills and they have experiential knowledge. 186 00:18:04,700 --> 00:18:08,620 You know, they have in some cases, they may have tried and failed to start at new businesses. 187 00:18:09,040 --> 00:18:16,270 They have gone through several iterations. Their experience of doing that, that process and the experience of their network is absolutely critical, 188 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:23,200 but is also there to be harnessed as a resource. So investing in those kinds of competencies, recognising them, 189 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:28,629 making explicit is actually things that SMEs can do, I think much more successfully the larger organisations. 190 00:18:28,630 --> 00:18:32,470 But in some senses, you know, marketing is something that is, that happens functionally, 191 00:18:32,470 --> 00:18:37,240 formally, institutionally, whereas within smaller firms it can happen informally. 192 00:18:37,810 --> 00:18:45,040 It can happen in a kind of social networked manner, which is often far more effective at that stage in the development of a firm. 193 00:18:46,550 --> 00:18:50,360 So let's think about what a small firm might do. And it won't come across the will it blend? 194 00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:55,510 So this. Yes. So let me just see if we can get this going and give you a demo of this. 195 00:18:56,170 --> 00:18:59,920 This is a great little organisation that started actually about 35 years ago. 196 00:18:59,920 --> 00:19:01,810 It's called the Blend Tech Corporation. 197 00:19:02,410 --> 00:19:12,340 It's a guy called Tom Dixon, who was a Start-Up back in 1975, and he had a newly patented micro noise in Greenville. 198 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:18,760 Okay. But the actual mechanism he used for creating the blade and the the chopping and 199 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:24,430 blending motion saw its best application in terms of a domestic household blender. 200 00:19:24,700 --> 00:19:27,759 So how does he communicate? Well, he's still going strong. 201 00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:33,190 He's the chairman of the company, founded the company. Well, that blend is a question. 202 00:19:47,990 --> 00:19:51,920 I love my new iPad. It does a ton of cool things. 203 00:19:52,460 --> 00:19:55,820 But will it blend? That is the question. 204 00:19:56,210 --> 00:20:00,260 It doesn't quite fit in the jar, but I can take care of that. 205 00:20:18,990 --> 00:20:22,230 I knew I could get the iPad in a blender. Total blender. 206 00:20:22,710 --> 00:20:51,250 I think I'll press the high blend button. Whoa. 207 00:20:52,420 --> 00:20:55,480 Oh, had smoke. Don't breathe this. 208 00:20:59,110 --> 00:21:07,479 That was one tough path. Okay. 209 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:11,380 So, well, he also has a website that I've got to see more. I mean, you know, that stands out. 210 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:20,180 First of all, he's the CEO. He's posting, promoting his product. Those with iPads, you can uncross your legs now it's safe to look again. 211 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:24,940 He has got rid of it. But again, what you see to demonstrate the point of difference is value proposition. 212 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:30,310 This thing will blend anything. Okay. And he's put his personal commitment behind that. 213 00:21:30,730 --> 00:21:34,000 And this is again, you know, this is a firm that is 35 years old. 214 00:21:34,330 --> 00:21:38,310 But actually he is using contemporary communications media. 215 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:43,810 This is actually on a YouTube channel. You can subscribe to it and get the latest things that he's blending, 216 00:21:44,380 --> 00:21:49,750 but it taps into his own creativity, his own skill at selling, his persuasive abilities. 217 00:21:50,110 --> 00:21:55,810 So never to be said that those skills don't exist in a small business because almost by definition, 218 00:21:56,050 --> 00:21:59,440 the creative skill does and can be harnessed to good effect. 219 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:08,680 So let's think about this creating customers piece of the equation, and here's where a piece of theory does come in handy. 220 00:22:09,370 --> 00:22:16,480 One of the ways in which marketing is changing, at least academically, is moving from what it was called sort of good, dominant logic. 221 00:22:16,990 --> 00:22:23,470 You made stuff and you sold it and actually you told consumers what to buy, even though you might have understood what their needs were. 222 00:22:23,740 --> 00:22:27,250 You know, there wasn't much kind of communication or consultation between buyer and seller. 223 00:22:27,670 --> 00:22:31,930 So the producer was was experienced, knowledgeable, says they're innovative, creative. 224 00:22:32,140 --> 00:22:37,600 The consumer was anything but passive, recipient of product or service. 225 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:42,640 And, you know, as you saw with the iPod, the value was destroyed in the consuming of the product. 226 00:22:43,930 --> 00:22:46,239 That's moving now to what's called a service dominant logic, 227 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:53,650 which effectively means that value is not created by a firm and then passed on to the customer, but is co-created. 228 00:22:53,830 --> 00:22:59,380 And that kind of phrase co-creation is something which is now preoccupying many marketers. 229 00:22:59,620 --> 00:23:03,310 But actually it makes sense when we think particularly about small businesses, 230 00:23:03,550 --> 00:23:10,630 it's harder to think about, I don't know, Lloyds Bank or Tesco co-creating value with its consumers. 231 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:17,620 You know, there are millions of them. How do they do that? But you can see it for a small organisation working creatively, 232 00:23:18,820 --> 00:23:27,490 integrating resources and ideas and experiences with a small group of potential customers to to actually refine and adapt an idea. 233 00:23:28,210 --> 00:23:34,780 And indeed, many of the the larger organisations that try to do this have had to do it using technology. 234 00:23:35,150 --> 00:23:37,510 So here's the here's the Starbucks site. 235 00:23:37,780 --> 00:23:48,640 My Starbucks, I did com which when I took the screen capture had generated 22,500 coffee and espresso drink ideas. 236 00:23:50,350 --> 00:23:57,520 Now okay. A wedding line of coffee mugs and a Starbucks in Herning, Denmark may not be particularly innovative, 237 00:23:58,570 --> 00:24:04,209 but the interesting idea is and if only one or two of those out of 1000 turns 238 00:24:04,210 --> 00:24:08,080 out to be an effective way in which Starbucks can increase its market share, 239 00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:13,390 can re-engage with its customer base, then it's been worth an effort of engagement. 240 00:24:14,650 --> 00:24:21,490 The issue is how far is this kind of rhetoric and hype and how far are these kinds of ideas really acted upon? 241 00:24:22,270 --> 00:24:27,309 And yeah, we can see a whole variety of them to do with with coffee and espresso drinks. 242 00:24:27,310 --> 00:24:33,730 I wrote that with a 2000 ideas could be, you know, actively worked within the organisation. 243 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:39,280 It's a bit like the UK Government seeking ideas for cutting interest in bureaucracy that they, 244 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:43,410 they had 30,000 suggestions and they implemented four of those. 245 00:24:43,420 --> 00:24:47,050 Okay. Because most of them were in principle. I think so but the. 246 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:58,210 The principle was there, but it was actually working with the consumer to try and refine, develop, harmonise the need and value proposition. 247 00:24:59,490 --> 00:25:06,240 It's only if you look at the theoretical models around this, the things like service industries, we find everyone talks about co-creating value. 248 00:25:06,690 --> 00:25:09,720 They talk about immersing yourselves in customers. 249 00:25:10,230 --> 00:25:15,240 And most of the textbooks along this line will talk about you getting down and working with your customers. 250 00:25:16,380 --> 00:25:22,560 Kind of all kinds of mechanisms, ranging from an observation of what the how they behave, 251 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:28,470 what they do, right the way through to developing scenarios with them, segmenting them, 252 00:25:28,770 --> 00:25:34,319 which sounds rather damaging, getting involved with what's called means and chain analysis, for example, 253 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:38,730 which is try to understand what their fundamental reasons for behaving as they do actually are. 254 00:25:39,210 --> 00:25:43,110 So a whole series of steps you can take to actually try and create that sort of value. 255 00:25:43,350 --> 00:25:49,080 But do they care? Do you, for example, to work with Tesco to create the next generation of Superstore? 256 00:25:49,740 --> 00:25:57,150 I rather suspect not. Okay, so another issue around creating customers and working with customers is do they want to work with you? 257 00:25:57,870 --> 00:26:04,290 So are your customer especially interested in what you're trying to do to work with you to make a better product or service? 258 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,580 And this is around involvement and we can think of this in consumer market terms. 259 00:26:09,030 --> 00:26:14,140 We can think about, for example, what might encourage customers to want to work with us. 260 00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:22,070 Well, for example, if something is very expensive, if they buy it rather infrequently, if it has high symbolic meaning, 261 00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:32,310 so something like a an iPad just to impact them has sort of high symbolic meaning, has high social visibility at the moment. 262 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:39,390 So there's a lot of interest in trying to work together to create a better product in order to meet those sorts of objectives. 263 00:26:40,020 --> 00:26:44,009 But actually, if your product is cheap, it's frequently purchased. 264 00:26:44,010 --> 00:26:48,960 It's pretty incidental. It doesn't take a much time to consume like a soft drink. 265 00:26:49,980 --> 00:26:56,250 It's not very socially visible. The toothpaste, I mean, you don't know what brunch of places I've used this morning on my my teeth. 266 00:26:57,330 --> 00:27:01,740 You don't really care as long my breath smells fresh and we talk over drinks afterwards, you know? 267 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:07,320 So thinking about social visibility is an indication of the level of involvement. 268 00:27:07,980 --> 00:27:14,370 So we can sort of think about co-creation, but really only if our customers care enough about what we're doing to want to work with us. 269 00:27:14,580 --> 00:27:22,560 And the challenge is to help them achieve that. So one of the ways of trying to find out whether our customers care is, well, asking them. 270 00:27:22,770 --> 00:27:24,210 And there are a variety of mechanisms. 271 00:27:24,630 --> 00:27:31,020 So in the example I've chosen this evening, I've drawn directly from university start-ups and certainly university related activities. 272 00:27:31,530 --> 00:27:34,710 And here's my first example, which is Galaxy Zoo. 273 00:27:34,860 --> 00:27:38,910 Anyone use Galaxy Zoo? Two, three, four. 274 00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:48,270 It's a crowdsourcing application. You come across these these are quite nice examples of trying to crunch through a 275 00:27:48,270 --> 00:27:54,750 problem using the mass power of linked computers and networks and individuals. 276 00:27:54,990 --> 00:27:58,290 And this is about crowdsourcing classifications of galactic objects. 277 00:27:58,590 --> 00:28:02,730 It's about as far from the iPad, I suppose, as you can get, although there's a pretty neat app for that. 278 00:28:03,510 --> 00:28:08,249 On the iPad, there's launched about four years ago. 279 00:28:08,250 --> 00:28:11,580 They were trying to initially to differentiate elliptical and spiral galaxies. 280 00:28:12,030 --> 00:28:15,510 But the important point to put across here is actually about awareness raising, 281 00:28:16,110 --> 00:28:20,310 because this process of actually gathering people who are interested in doing this sort of stuff, 282 00:28:20,670 --> 00:28:26,940 who want to spend their evening not watching X Factor but classifying galaxies, I don't know which I'd rather be doing, frankly, 283 00:28:27,060 --> 00:28:35,640 given where Wagner is at the moment, but I think we have a very good way of identifying potentially interesting prospects. 284 00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:38,940 Now, a quarter million collaborators working on our Galaxy Zoo, 285 00:28:39,570 --> 00:28:44,070 which actually is bigger than Oxford, 138,000 people in Oxford, big in the British Army. 286 00:28:44,250 --> 00:28:49,740 And my favourite example is more than the number of Quakers in North and South America combined. 287 00:28:49,980 --> 00:28:55,440 Okay, now collaborating in this Galaxy Z project and the awareness that has been generated for this, you know, 288 00:28:55,440 --> 00:29:01,560 for people here, using it online is, is quite substantial internationally as well as within the UK. 289 00:29:02,190 --> 00:29:08,040 So again, there are now technological mechanisms for gathering intelligence about people who might be interested in what you're doing. 290 00:29:09,130 --> 00:29:14,470 Here's another example of more, I suppose more relevant example for those of you interested in scholarship and research. 291 00:29:14,980 --> 00:29:18,330 This is a Start-Up from a marketing Ph.D. student. 292 00:29:18,350 --> 00:29:28,330 The other guys from medicine, I think, who have started up a small organisation which is around a research management tool for scholars. 293 00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:33,910 So often these days we're doing cognitive research between departments of university, 294 00:29:33,910 --> 00:29:38,139 between different universities, keeping each other in touch internationally, 295 00:29:38,140 --> 00:29:44,830 particularly with papers that you've come across with interesting ideas and you annotations of views on those papers is quite difficult. 296 00:29:45,100 --> 00:29:48,460 You can't send the PDF because of the copyright issues and so on. 297 00:29:48,970 --> 00:29:56,980 Mandalay dot com is an organisation set up to to establish the online research network so you can create collaborative networks online, 298 00:29:57,250 --> 00:30:03,520 share your research findings or your research literature with others. 299 00:30:04,780 --> 00:30:08,620 And this is the thing here is actually this has taken off again exponentially through word of mouth. 300 00:30:09,010 --> 00:30:13,989 So creating awareness. This particular service now has gone through the last well, 301 00:30:13,990 --> 00:30:19,389 the last two or three years from just being a sort of a specialist bespoke interest 302 00:30:19,390 --> 00:30:25,540 of a few Ph.D. students because of the amounts being lectured on by academics in 303 00:30:25,540 --> 00:30:29,919 universities trying to cut costs and encourage people to use these kinds of free to air 304 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:35,050 services rather than actually buying that expensive database aggregation services. 305 00:30:35,710 --> 00:30:40,780 But the point I wanted to mention on this particular example is not so much the awareness raising, 306 00:30:41,020 --> 00:30:46,270 but the way in which Mandalay has creatively sought to reach out to its customer base. 307 00:30:46,990 --> 00:30:55,570 So every university campus, for example, has a series of brand ambassadors that will market the the Mandalay Service on on behalf of the business, 308 00:30:56,110 --> 00:31:02,110 as well as the usual Twitter, Facebook activity. And and so peer reviews, those are kind of spread the word service. 309 00:31:02,110 --> 00:31:08,890 So incentives to to spread the word about the the activity and also to become an advisor. 310 00:31:09,190 --> 00:31:14,260 This is critical. Becoming an advisor means that you can help play a part in the way in which the Mandalay Service develops. 311 00:31:14,470 --> 00:31:18,340 You can help prioritise particular features and push on others that are less important. 312 00:31:18,730 --> 00:31:25,150 There's a kind of creative evolution going on here with some of the leading super users, if you like, at Mandalay, 313 00:31:25,660 --> 00:31:33,010 who are helping to to create a more usable, useful and durable and, frankly, competitively defensible product. 314 00:31:33,490 --> 00:31:44,350 Because the the customers are working with Mandalay to create a mutually useful value proposition between this research network. 315 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:50,020 And already Mandalay is in the top ten of the top tech companies. 316 00:31:50,770 --> 00:31:56,440 The CTO of Amazon.com says he strongly believes that Mandalay Mandalay can change the face of the face of science. 317 00:31:56,710 --> 00:32:00,490 Certainly, it can help improve personal and research productivity. 318 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:04,569 Absolutely. So that's the value proposition. If you know any researchers, 319 00:32:04,570 --> 00:32:15,250 if you are that researcher that has a room full of print out or that has a laptop which has whole hard disks full of undifferentiated research papers, 320 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:19,960 the Mandalay is the service for you, and I'm not even an advisor, so I can highly recommend it to. 321 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:24,639 Okay, so creating customers is about using those networks. 322 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:34,360 It's about using innovative ways of reaching out to interested parties, working with them to create the product at an early stage. 323 00:32:34,990 --> 00:32:38,200 Let's think a little bit about keeping those customers because it's all very well. 324 00:32:39,290 --> 00:32:43,910 Getting excited. Raising their awareness, raising their expectations. 325 00:32:44,210 --> 00:32:47,720 How do we think about keeping that custom? 326 00:32:48,260 --> 00:32:56,150 Well, in many ways, the keeping of customers for a small organisation is very similar to that for many larger organisations. 327 00:32:56,230 --> 00:33:01,900 Some choices. Are you the kind of organisation that's simply into transactional exchanges? 328 00:33:01,950 --> 00:33:06,490 The left hand side, are you just selling stuff to people? You know, there's no one else in the marketplace. 329 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:12,089 So, for example, the value of alternatives is pretty is pretty many. 330 00:33:12,090 --> 00:33:17,760 The naturally you could end up simply being an anonymous transact product along with everybody else. 331 00:33:18,660 --> 00:33:22,920 But actually, if there are relatively few alternatives, people will be the path to your door. 332 00:33:23,310 --> 00:33:25,260 People want collaborative exchanges. 333 00:33:25,270 --> 00:33:34,860 People want to continue to work with you in refining the product, as Mandela is saying, but perhaps will also want to recommend you to their friends. 334 00:33:36,450 --> 00:33:42,990 I would also want to perhaps get you to produce bespoke things for them to do for a business business activity. 335 00:33:43,230 --> 00:33:46,650 So thinking about whether you're at the transactional end of the spectrum or the 336 00:33:46,650 --> 00:33:50,430 collaborative end of the spectrum is a choice that you need to think about. 337 00:33:50,940 --> 00:33:55,500 The other factors are going to be important as well. Again, how important is the purchase for the buyer? 338 00:33:56,580 --> 00:34:03,090 How complex the purchase is? The purchase is very complex that actually the buyer is going to want to quite close to. 339 00:34:03,090 --> 00:34:07,470 You want to work with you to understand the full implications of what they're buying. 340 00:34:07,740 --> 00:34:15,240 Perhaps there are complex after sales services and add ons that you'll want to produce that will make that collaboration quite important to the buyer. 341 00:34:17,370 --> 00:34:22,440 Perhaps there's a lot of scope for information exchange, perhaps. It isn't just about buying it, walking away and using it. 342 00:34:22,860 --> 00:34:26,130 Perhaps there are many things that the buyer will have to talk to you about afterwards. 343 00:34:26,710 --> 00:34:31,650 If you could invent or create those kinds of things, then you have a way of maintaining that relationship. 344 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:39,360 But I think the word relationship has been overused, frankly, for many large organisations. 345 00:34:40,460 --> 00:34:46,910 There is a deliberate attempt to try and disrupt cosy relationships between buyers and sellers because 346 00:34:46,910 --> 00:34:51,680 you get into very dangerous territory once you start to get a bit too cosy between buyers and sellers. 347 00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:56,570 And so what you find is a decision making is a larger firm is actually quite formal. 348 00:34:56,900 --> 00:35:02,280 It may even be a procurement committee that is considering your product or service and then the people 349 00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:06,620 to actually have the relationship where there's not so much the the initiators or the deciders, 350 00:35:06,890 --> 00:35:13,460 but actually the gatekeepers, those people who control the flow of access to the firm they are trying to supply to. 351 00:35:13,850 --> 00:35:22,700 And often that's the buyer or the secretary or the PR or the person that actually signs away at the front desk who helps with the phone number, 352 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:30,200 the person you want to reach. So appropriate relationships may be quite important in dealing with formal buying structures. 353 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,980 I think the relationship metaphor itself has been considerably overused. 354 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:39,839 Again, you know, do you really want a relationship with your supermarket as a loyalty card? 355 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:43,290 And some might imply that you do. I was a small firm, though. 356 00:35:43,290 --> 00:35:48,780 I think the relationship you have with your immediate network is very, very important. 357 00:35:49,500 --> 00:35:52,829 When you get large and very few companies really have, I think, 358 00:35:52,830 --> 00:36:00,330 reached the kind of nirvana of having a kind of a genuine relationship with some of their customers. 359 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:04,620 I think of operations like Harley Davidson, for example, the Body Shop had this. 360 00:36:04,650 --> 00:36:10,380 Southwest Airlines in the states that have loyal and, you know, regular recommenders of what they do. 361 00:36:11,610 --> 00:36:18,270 Actually, frankly, most of us deal with organisations on a transactional or loose relationship basis. 362 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:24,990 We don't think about Tesco in the same way. We think about our partner at home or our boyfriend or girlfriend, thank goodness. 363 00:36:25,140 --> 00:36:33,240 So what's my thing? So thinking about some of these ways in which academics think about relationship marketing, the marriage model. 364 00:36:35,110 --> 00:36:36,570 They talk about the life cycle. 365 00:36:36,580 --> 00:36:46,090 You know, you go through establishing this relationship, you court you got for a while, you know you you procreate, you have children products. 366 00:36:46,090 --> 00:36:49,959 You know, these kind of analogies are all rather dodgy, frankly, 367 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:55,810 when it comes to thinking about how, again, small firms may need to work in this kind of area. 368 00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:01,060 So relationships can be quite a dangerous analogy to use. Dangerous metaphor to use. 369 00:37:02,530 --> 00:37:09,370 We also hear a lot of talk about brand communities. I think brown communities are quite interesting in this area because what the Brown 370 00:37:09,370 --> 00:37:17,590 community is is in effect a stable relationship between an organisation and its admirers. 371 00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:24,560 And just like any other community, we know who the other admirers off of that brand. 372 00:37:24,740 --> 00:37:29,770 So, for example, you know, again, who's got an iPad? Yeah. 373 00:37:29,830 --> 00:37:33,549 Okay. So, yeah, well, we're all we're one of a kind plus I part owners. 374 00:37:33,550 --> 00:37:37,550 Okay, so there a consciousness of kind. We go through rites and rituals. 375 00:37:37,570 --> 00:37:41,469 So we'll. We'll do an exchange of apps later over drinks. 376 00:37:41,470 --> 00:37:46,150 Okay. Have you seen this really great one? You know, there's a mall responsibility. 377 00:37:46,150 --> 00:37:52,630 So if I dropped my iPad on the floor, you know, every iPad owner will groan, but many of them will rush to my aid. 378 00:37:52,950 --> 00:37:58,180 Okay. Thought you may laugh, but actually the research shows that for car ownership, for example, 379 00:37:59,230 --> 00:38:05,500 you're more likely to stop for the person that is driving a car like yours than you are for any other person. 380 00:38:05,780 --> 00:38:10,330 So what about the maybe your next motor? Okay, you'll stop for them because they're driving the same colour Saab as you. 381 00:38:11,020 --> 00:38:14,499 So they must be like you. And you know, you wouldn't want to let like a situation, would you? 382 00:38:14,500 --> 00:38:20,500 So a brown community is very much around, you know, moral responsibility and obligation to each other. 383 00:38:20,980 --> 00:38:24,850 Now, you know, again, within a small organisation building that kind of close community, 384 00:38:25,260 --> 00:38:33,909 the small number of buyers who are mutually interdependent, who understand the values and motives of the organisation, 385 00:38:33,910 --> 00:38:36,190 the trust the organisation is really, 386 00:38:36,190 --> 00:38:45,880 really critical to retaining the customer base and in some senses the Brown community is actually a very effective way of trying to do that. 387 00:38:46,240 --> 00:38:50,740 They hard to create. So here's an example of one anyone to use Wolfram Alpha. 388 00:38:51,930 --> 00:38:55,830 Oh, more hands this time. Very good. So some mathematicians in the room, which is excellent. 389 00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:03,840 Now, Wolfram Alpha, as you may know, those were the hands of at least, you know, it was actually a an in fact, a specialised search engine. 390 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:10,200 So so specialised. You need a training to work out how to ask the question, let alone understand the answer. 391 00:39:11,070 --> 00:39:16,460 Okay. But here's a great example of a brown community, a small business as it started up. 392 00:39:16,470 --> 00:39:23,400 So Mathematica, which Wolfram Research founded several years ago, over 20 years ago, 393 00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:28,860 now generated established user base of the mathematical programming language. 394 00:39:29,070 --> 00:39:39,150 And it was that user base that Wolfram used to piggyback on to launch Wolfram Alpha, working with those customers to understand their needs. 395 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:46,470 And indeed, you know, to to get this was a kick start in terms of both creating and then retaining Mathematica users. 396 00:39:47,070 --> 00:39:50,580 So the kinds of quotes here, you know, could be as important as Google, 397 00:39:51,090 --> 00:39:57,870 but making all systematic knowledge immediately computable and accessible to everyone or otherwise accessible by 14 year old son. 398 00:39:57,870 --> 00:40:01,590 I find it rather harder to get beyond Wolfram Alpha as interface, I must admit. 399 00:40:01,860 --> 00:40:02,670 But you know, 400 00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:12,810 this is certainly a great example of a small firm which is is keeping its customer base onside in the kind of work it's doing through its conferences, 401 00:40:13,110 --> 00:40:15,720 through its seminars and activities, through its outreach, 402 00:40:16,290 --> 00:40:22,860 and through the ways in which it works with its users to continually evolve its products and services. 403 00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:28,690 How do you keep in touch in retaining your customer base? 404 00:40:28,720 --> 00:40:36,490 Well, when you ask many firms, you know, what kinds of communications channels are becoming more or less effective. 405 00:40:36,940 --> 00:40:41,620 This is what you come up with. This is a subject in the US a couple years ago and it's, it's, 406 00:40:41,620 --> 00:40:50,230 it's ranking communications channels by the most at the top, the least the bottom in terms of increasing effectiveness. 407 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:56,410 And it's quite easy to see that in declining effectiveness. We see newspapers, yellow pages, telemarketing. 408 00:40:57,100 --> 00:41:07,719 So getting your your friends together hit the phones to some of sales may no longer be as effective as we thought it was far more effective, 409 00:41:07,720 --> 00:41:11,200 according to respondents. A social media search. Engine marketing. 410 00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:14,410 Mobile channels. Online video games. 411 00:41:15,790 --> 00:41:19,360 Anyone bought that? Some new game. What's it called? 412 00:41:21,830 --> 00:41:27,370 Thank you. Very good. Who's got that new game? 413 00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:33,090 If you feel this isn't quite right for you, you have an audience of 15 year olds. 414 00:41:33,240 --> 00:41:34,680 Every hand would shoot up. Okay. 415 00:41:35,580 --> 00:41:43,530 But, you know, game marketing using gaming as a marketing channel is a really interesting way at the moment of of promoting products and services. 416 00:41:43,950 --> 00:41:49,260 But, you know, keeping in touch with your customer base increasingly requires skills and capabilities, 417 00:41:49,500 --> 00:41:53,190 not just in traditional channels, but in, of course, newer channels, too. 418 00:41:53,700 --> 00:42:03,480 And the examples I've given you, like Galaxy Zoo and Mandalay could not exist were it not for the Internet and for the social media. 419 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:08,700 But let's just take a look at companies say this. But what are customers say? 420 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:14,819 How much do you trust what you hear through various kinds of channels and actually. 421 00:42:14,820 --> 00:42:19,560 Well, email. Sure, I trust it, but only from people I know. 422 00:42:19,620 --> 00:42:23,220 Three quarters. What's the top ranking sort of information source? 423 00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:27,090 Customer products. Ratings and reviews. Portals and search engines. 424 00:42:27,090 --> 00:42:35,580 Yellow Pages. Not online. So actually, even though on the one hand, companies say Yellow Pages are declining in effectiveness, 425 00:42:36,210 --> 00:42:41,370 they're still the number four in terms of people's willingness to search out information. 426 00:42:41,380 --> 00:42:46,050 So again, you can be a bit careful interpreting some of the findings from this kind of research 427 00:42:46,050 --> 00:42:50,640 because it might be quite what people want to think the researchers want to hear. 428 00:42:50,700 --> 00:42:54,719 Of course. Social media. Yes, absolutely. We're all kind of investing in Twitter and Facebook over the next few years. 429 00:42:54,720 --> 00:42:57,330 Of course we are. You know what for? But we're gonna be doing it. 430 00:42:58,770 --> 00:43:05,460 We're actually in fact, you know, perhaps some selected magazine promotions could be an effective way of keeping in touch. 431 00:43:05,850 --> 00:43:10,680 So think carefully about choosing the right kinds of promotional media, 432 00:43:11,180 --> 00:43:16,680 the most cost effective promotional media to meet the objectives and the characteristics of your customer base. 433 00:43:17,130 --> 00:43:22,760 Let's think of two or three examples. So email, first of all. Sure there are great advantages of email. 434 00:43:23,150 --> 00:43:29,450 It's fantastically cheap, i.e. free in many cases because it's subsumed within your ISP cost. 435 00:43:30,050 --> 00:43:33,140 It's a tremendously effective campaign tool. 436 00:43:33,590 --> 00:43:41,060 So if you're into selling or promoting lots of things, lots of people, you know very quickly how effective your promotional mechanism has been. 437 00:43:41,540 --> 00:43:47,600 If you're offering a three, four, one or four for one price offer, you know, you can know very instantly how effective that is. 438 00:43:48,020 --> 00:43:53,870 And it's a it's a push tool. If you're not waiting for customers to ask you for stuff, you're pushing it out to them. 439 00:43:54,500 --> 00:44:02,660 But as I suggested, perhaps, you know, push marketing may not be as effective as the kind of collaborative or consensual marketing, 440 00:44:03,380 --> 00:44:09,830 permissive marketing we often hear talked about today. So we see lots of advantages of email campaigns and track ability. 441 00:44:10,860 --> 00:44:17,250 But we look at how consumers think about email. They're only really interested in getting email from people that they trust that they know. 442 00:44:18,180 --> 00:44:24,090 Increasingly, of course, we have lots of mechanisms now for cutting out a lot of the information overload. 443 00:44:24,540 --> 00:44:31,769 You know, a lot of filters, either manual or automatic to kind of spam, commercial messaging. 444 00:44:31,770 --> 00:44:40,830 So getting and retaining contact with your customers is about ensuring that you are trusted by them enough to be on their waitlist of incoming email. 445 00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:47,370 And what that also starts to suggest is that email marketing may be changing in terms of its level of impact. 446 00:44:47,670 --> 00:44:49,860 Well, I think it actually certainly is. 447 00:44:50,220 --> 00:44:57,930 This data suggests that that actually those people are thinking that the impact of email is actually increasing. 448 00:44:57,930 --> 00:45:01,470 A lot has fallen over the last two or three years. 449 00:45:01,890 --> 00:45:06,570 So the impression is that actually we're not getting perhaps even that's free as much of the impact 450 00:45:06,570 --> 00:45:11,400 as we would like to that current technology or we can engage in this will be addressed later. 451 00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:19,559 This is a qualitative visualisation is a great start start a company called Vaughan's one page summary. 452 00:45:19,560 --> 00:45:30,030 It's highly recommended to the organisation. He's a great index MBA and he's now selling his ability to synthesise onto one page complex stuff. 453 00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:33,810 Okay, so this is how search engine optimisation works. 454 00:45:34,140 --> 00:45:37,860 Okay. Now, I think you might have to get his consulting services for him to interpret this. 455 00:45:39,300 --> 00:45:42,030 And I'm sure that's part of the value proposition for this particular business. 456 00:45:42,690 --> 00:45:48,420 But this book, the one page summary, first of all, says how complex search engine optimisation is. 457 00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:50,880 But it also says little bit about, you know, 458 00:45:51,300 --> 00:46:01,920 how it works in terms of the the the nature of the the rankings of terms and where the money is made by Google and by others in this kind of activity. 459 00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:09,510 So certainly, if you're a company that is seeking to attract and retain customers through search engine optimisation. 460 00:46:10,500 --> 00:46:13,290 Perhaps you've got a product that really is the kind of thing that people will 461 00:46:13,290 --> 00:46:17,070 really search for because they only want something like this once in a blue moon. 462 00:46:17,670 --> 00:46:21,690 Take more trips. How many of you bought a mobile trap recently? 463 00:46:21,810 --> 00:46:24,870 Anyone? Nobody. You. I have. 464 00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:28,630 Sorry. Okay. Now. So we have an allotment and we have. 465 00:46:28,630 --> 00:46:33,700 We have exhausted all possible humane routes to mole disposal. 466 00:46:33,850 --> 00:46:38,820 Okay. So my wife instructed me to go out and find some mole traps. 467 00:46:38,830 --> 00:46:42,220 What I do. I Google mole traps. What do I find? 468 00:46:42,850 --> 00:46:46,480 Search engine optimisation gives me mole traps. Dot co.uk. 469 00:46:49,710 --> 00:46:55,920 And there it is. This is one guy, a traditional mole catcher based in Sussex. 470 00:46:56,910 --> 00:47:03,510 He spent his life catching moles, designing traps with gamekeepers to catch and dispatch moles humanely. 471 00:47:03,780 --> 00:47:08,490 Although you might be forgiven for thinking not quite so humane when you see some of the images there. 472 00:47:09,870 --> 00:47:16,380 But here is again a single bloke who has gone around using new technology to reach and retain customers. 473 00:47:16,410 --> 00:47:21,810 I've been talking about this guy to my neighbours who are equally trouble with moles for the last six months. 474 00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:27,390 His profits must be going through the roof, but he has managed to retain the customer base, not through email, 475 00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:36,120 although he does have an email subscription service, but actually simply through intelligent use of the search engine optimisation technology. 476 00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:39,840 And but if I look at this now, there is now a competitor. 477 00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:46,840 Okay. More traps online. Okay. So here we have a mole in case you hadn't seen one before. 478 00:47:48,030 --> 00:47:54,540 But you see the trap there. It's not very nice if you're looking for a, you know, a nice, soothing image of how to buy a mole. 479 00:47:54,690 --> 00:47:58,950 There's there's a problem. You see that? That's the problem that you're trying to solve. 480 00:47:59,100 --> 00:48:06,570 Whereas mole traps online. Well, you know, they're just talking about the the nasty metal trap that you have to buy. 481 00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,540 So it's search optimisation for certain kinds of parts. 482 00:48:09,540 --> 00:48:16,050 And services can be a very effective way of communicating and keeping in touch with your customer base. 483 00:48:16,530 --> 00:48:24,600 But frankly, far more effective, I think is, again, smaller organisations, word of mouth, particularly electronic word of mouth. 484 00:48:25,140 --> 00:48:30,150 Keeping in touch either through talking to prospective customers, 485 00:48:30,150 --> 00:48:35,670 talking to your friends through recommendation or through some kind of sponsored activity, some kind of forum. 486 00:48:36,570 --> 00:48:42,060 And there's been a substantial growth in third party for people who are interested in certain kinds of things. 487 00:48:42,460 --> 00:48:46,650 So the Galaxy Zoo, for example, has a has a forum, a number of these kinds. 488 00:48:46,650 --> 00:48:53,010 Mandalay has a forum for its users. It's a way of keeping in touch with developments. 489 00:48:53,190 --> 00:49:00,000 It's a way for users to talk to other users and to keep themselves excited and enthused about your products and services. 490 00:49:00,450 --> 00:49:07,200 Now, some of these are quite spontaneous. Some of them are actually sponsored or hosted by third parties who are seen as being neutral objective. 491 00:49:07,830 --> 00:49:12,330 The less successful ones can sometimes be so corporate sponsored, a bit like brown communities. 492 00:49:12,330 --> 00:49:14,190 You know, if you look at them too carefully, they go away. 493 00:49:14,580 --> 00:49:21,360 They always have to be spontaneous and from the grassroots and from your users, rather than imposed and created by you as the firm. 494 00:49:24,150 --> 00:49:28,110 And of course, social media and all also about social media at this point. 495 00:49:28,110 --> 00:49:32,220 It really is to say, look, be very, very careful that you're clear. 496 00:49:32,460 --> 00:49:38,700 Again, what are your objectives for using social media? Do your customers or customers use social media? 497 00:49:39,180 --> 00:49:46,409 Which ones do they use? What does what role does your Facebook page or your YouTube channel or your Twitter 498 00:49:46,410 --> 00:49:52,080 channel play in the bullying decision making process of your ideal customer? 499 00:49:52,740 --> 00:49:57,450 So don't just jump on the bandwagon. Don't just launch a fan page or Twitter feed. 500 00:49:58,470 --> 00:50:01,090 I was just. For the fun of it. 501 00:50:01,270 --> 00:50:09,220 Clearly, I have nothing better to do with my time spending some time assembling a list of rather redundant Twitter feeds by companies, 502 00:50:09,670 --> 00:50:15,670 and this one by a company called Electro Space, which tweets every time it has a new solution to a problem. 503 00:50:16,720 --> 00:50:25,780 Okay, now I region will know that in fact my most useful Twitter feed is actually now Eurostar because Eurostar tweets very, 504 00:50:25,780 --> 00:50:29,470 very often and successfully that I didn't last Christmas when things went badly wrong. 505 00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:34,690 But that tweets a lot about the reliability of trains under the channel. 506 00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:40,210 And my second most useful Twitter feed is actually the people who complained about first great western. 507 00:50:41,140 --> 00:50:44,080 If you search for hashtag on Twitter, 508 00:50:44,500 --> 00:50:54,760 you will find that there is a word of mouth community who basically are united in their hatred and despise of First Great Western as a service. 509 00:50:54,760 --> 00:51:01,600 And you can read some cracking anecdotes in 149 characters, one of two characters of of their commuting experiences. 510 00:51:01,810 --> 00:51:07,600 They finally feel great, first great western. I've been monitoring that to understand how my consumers felt about my brand. 511 00:51:07,870 --> 00:51:11,890 I'm not sure they do. Or if they do, they well, they didn't do much about it. 512 00:51:12,340 --> 00:51:16,850 So social media is clearly around a variety of objectives. 513 00:51:16,870 --> 00:51:21,640 It's about certainly that that intelligence keeping in touch with what your user base is thinking, 514 00:51:22,420 --> 00:51:26,499 because almost certainly there are people tweeting in this room now who are saying he's gone too long. 515 00:51:26,500 --> 00:51:29,760 It's 2 minutes to go and he's still talking. Isn't so much about the last bit you want to talk about. 516 00:51:29,810 --> 00:51:34,210 So. So there's always this back chatter going on with Twitter that we need to be aware of. 517 00:51:34,630 --> 00:51:38,050 But again, these kinds of channels are largely free to air. 518 00:51:38,740 --> 00:51:40,090 How do we use them effectively? 519 00:51:40,270 --> 00:51:46,510 It's going to be a consideration for particularly for small firms who see this as a potential mechanism to reach the marketplace. 520 00:51:47,050 --> 00:51:50,560 If you don't, your customers may do so. Here's a great example. 521 00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:57,160 In Japan, actually, this is of 25,000 Japanese consumers had nothing better to do with their time to 522 00:51:57,160 --> 00:52:00,910 tell each other about where the best deals are in the regional supermarkets. 523 00:52:01,270 --> 00:52:04,630 Okay. And they're driving these firms out of business. 524 00:52:05,470 --> 00:52:13,000 So they are simply sharing all this discount information and sabotaging, as it says, their efforts to save Japan's economy from stagnation. 525 00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:20,049 This is a bit like the time when Japanese consumers were were collecting telephone cards with charge 526 00:52:20,050 --> 00:52:25,360 money on them and at one point had something like 5% of GDP wrapped up in collected telephone calls. 527 00:52:25,660 --> 00:52:32,320 So there's this thing called phenomenon is actually crowdsourcing of intelligence, consumer to consumer intelligence. 528 00:52:33,870 --> 00:52:38,159 So it's got to do with ultimately small businesses keeping customers when it 529 00:52:38,160 --> 00:52:43,080 comes down in the end to sustaining customer satisfaction and customer loyalty. 530 00:52:44,010 --> 00:52:47,310 Satisfaction is a dangerous word, as is loyalty, frankly, 531 00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:53,009 because actually many customers will often tell you what they think you want to hear rather than what you want 532 00:52:53,010 --> 00:52:59,220 to know about how they're doing for how you're doing in terms of your provision of products and services. 533 00:52:59,940 --> 00:53:04,500 So it's thinking about how you gather satisfaction data is quite important. 534 00:53:05,010 --> 00:53:14,010 Similarly, thinking about how you move from satisfaction to loyalty, what kind of loyalty you're looking for, you're looking simply for price loyalty. 535 00:53:14,730 --> 00:53:22,290 Well, we are cheapest this week. Or are you looking for that real emotional loyalty that might lead to a lifetime relationship with a customer? 536 00:53:23,380 --> 00:53:28,000 That will determine the way in which you seek to cultivate and retain your customer base. 537 00:53:29,930 --> 00:53:34,009 Now if you're a service organisation then similar things will apply. 538 00:53:34,010 --> 00:53:41,329 But actually the way in which you will want to move from simply ensuring good quality services to 539 00:53:41,330 --> 00:53:45,170 ensuring innovation in services is something that you're going to want to have to think about. 540 00:53:45,860 --> 00:53:49,249 And the challenge here is really about service quality, 541 00:53:49,250 --> 00:53:58,399 because when you're consuming a service and let me give you an example of a classic service that is not will it blend, 542 00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:08,240 but actually is is one started up by a former engineering manager student here, Caroline Plum and her colleague Charlie Osman. 543 00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:14,540 Caroline recently went with David Cameron on the the business investment trip to India. 544 00:54:14,600 --> 00:54:20,749 So it hasn't she done well and is also on the advisory board for the for the business school. 545 00:54:20,750 --> 00:54:24,350 But she started as a small organisation with fresh minds, 546 00:54:24,650 --> 00:54:31,970 which started off using the talent of university students to do cheap consulting for companies undercutting Deloittes, 547 00:54:32,180 --> 00:54:35,510 McKinsey, Bain and maybe even doing a better job. Who knows? 548 00:54:36,890 --> 00:54:44,360 This kind of organisation was very much about generating, first of all, a reliable quality research. 549 00:54:45,140 --> 00:54:46,910 It was about also word of mouth. 550 00:54:47,570 --> 00:54:55,040 So people who got good work from this team told them, told their friends, told their colleagues, other organisations they in turn recruited. 551 00:54:55,880 --> 00:55:04,910 It spun off into fresh minds talent. So sure, these students wanted to do some some research work, but they also wanted the job at the end of it. 552 00:55:05,030 --> 00:55:12,800 So the talent division of the organisation and then into independent research as well as simply the thinking activity, 553 00:55:13,280 --> 00:55:17,450 the fresh minds of the businesses has retained its customer base by keeping customers 554 00:55:17,450 --> 00:55:21,740 satisfied in terms of the quality of the service that they have been experiencing. 555 00:55:22,580 --> 00:55:24,560 And think about this diagram. 556 00:55:25,910 --> 00:55:35,030 Ensuring that expected quality is to say what you would expect of high quality consulting service is actually exceeded by experienced quality, 557 00:55:35,630 --> 00:55:38,750 which means your perception is actually wow, that was really great experience. 558 00:55:38,750 --> 00:55:46,790 I have a lot of that is through word of mouth. It's through effective marketing communication and it through past experience services. 559 00:55:47,750 --> 00:55:52,450 Let me finish with a couple of practical examples of organisations. 560 00:55:52,450 --> 00:55:57,110 So there's one retail example. Here's a recent example that started very small. 561 00:55:57,950 --> 00:56:03,919 And again, let's see if we can draw together all the lessons of the things I talked about this evening, 562 00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:14,360 about building customer awareness, about reaching and retaining customers, about ensuring service quality in what you're delivering. 563 00:56:14,570 --> 00:56:21,200 Zappos probably one of the most exciting shoe shops online ever to hit the airwaves. 564 00:56:22,340 --> 00:56:24,079 It's the most extraordinary business. 565 00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:31,370 And in fact, Amazon has sought to bottle the customer service mentality and organisational culture of Zappos by buying the business. 566 00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:35,750 But just before it bought it, it was worth about $1,000,000,000 in terms of sales. 567 00:56:36,590 --> 00:56:47,060 So it started very small. The founder started really just selling a small number of shoe ranges online, grew into this phenomenal business, 568 00:56:47,390 --> 00:56:51,350 which is not really about selling shoes, but it's really about good customer service. 569 00:56:51,500 --> 00:56:54,680 So the value proposition is about in effect. 570 00:56:55,740 --> 00:57:00,390 The kind of quality customer service that you simply didn't get from regular shops, 571 00:57:01,020 --> 00:57:05,340 but for some reason you could get online, which is quite a paradoxical thing. 572 00:57:06,240 --> 00:57:10,290 And that's because that Zappos, as much as much a culture where they recruit their talent, 573 00:57:10,290 --> 00:57:18,150 the way they deal with the customer base, they get 5000 calls a day, torrent of emails a day, they deal with those on the spot. 574 00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:25,440 An email responded to within within half an hour. The loyalty team works around the clock. 575 00:57:26,130 --> 00:57:29,070 They are quite amazing sorts of individuals. 576 00:57:29,070 --> 00:57:36,930 They recruit for weirdness, I think actually, and certainly not your conventional kind of call centre employee, 577 00:57:38,130 --> 00:57:41,250 but very much there's a link to a YouTube video just to see the action, 578 00:57:41,430 --> 00:57:46,500 very much a value proposition which is built around retaining customers through word of mouth effects. 579 00:57:47,070 --> 00:57:52,330 So everyone raves about their Zappos experience because they don't only meet expectations, 580 00:57:52,330 --> 00:57:55,770 but they exceed quality expectations in terms of customer service. 581 00:57:56,070 --> 00:58:03,900 So it does more than it says on the tin. And all the time they're proving they go beyond what customers would expect for a conventional shoe retailer. 582 00:58:06,660 --> 00:58:11,390 My final example is a local firm, and that's alchemical thinking alchemy. 583 00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:17,280 You've got all these things coming together. You've got, first of all, an Oxford start up. 584 00:58:17,500 --> 00:58:24,959 Think it's really great idea. Founded in Oxfordshire around about ten years ago now worth around 17 million. 585 00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:27,390 So relatively modest in terms of revenue over that period of time. 586 00:58:27,930 --> 00:58:34,980 But the business they've got almost sets a C along co-creation of value because what they're about is a stock photography site. 587 00:58:35,250 --> 00:58:38,550 It's not like some of the big ones that you see. 588 00:58:38,790 --> 00:58:46,619 This is actually one that is there as much for the benefit of the the members, if you like, because they're always members rather than customers than, 589 00:58:46,620 --> 00:58:55,830 you know, for some kind of vast commercial profit to be gained by gouging customers of some of the very large houses might be alleged to be doing. 590 00:58:56,310 --> 00:59:02,160 And the way in which they work is very much around keeping customers through fairness and trust. 591 00:59:03,480 --> 00:59:10,740 They have very flexible contracts compared to many of the larger organisations that have a very fixed and often quite exploitative contracts. 592 00:59:11,460 --> 00:59:21,090 They have much higher royalties. Um, they work with customers and thinking about new ways of bringing new services and products to bear. 593 00:59:21,450 --> 00:59:24,630 So here's an example of that, which is the find the photographer service, 594 00:59:24,900 --> 00:59:30,930 which is a kind of Google map mash up where to find an amateur photographer if you want some some 595 00:59:31,170 --> 00:59:39,070 it's not going to be a wedding ranking collaborative ranking the the quality and the interest. 596 00:59:39,080 --> 00:59:43,500 A particular photograph alamy rank using their customers to source, 597 00:59:43,500 --> 00:59:47,070 review and recommendation information, which is a now more conventional kind of approach. 598 00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:52,139 But then also this obsessive customer service, which is really about fairness and around trust. 599 00:59:52,140 --> 00:59:57,780 So those those values of the organisation have been transitioned to a value proposition which is then 600 00:59:57,780 --> 01:00:04,980 communicated to customers and they're not really customers because some of the customers are also suppliers. 601 01:00:05,310 --> 01:00:08,370 So you've got suppliers supplying photographs, 602 01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:14,130 you've got suppliers who are also customers and you've got customers who are being dealt with fairly 603 01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:20,880 and can see that they're making a contribution to the success of amateur photography within the UK. 604 01:00:21,330 --> 01:00:31,680 And as a result we've got 20 of the images, 21,000 photographers, a fantastic network in this case, a resource for that city to use to mine, 605 01:00:31,950 --> 01:00:38,520 for new ideas, for recommendation, for cross-selling opportunities, you know, word of mouth effects. 606 01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:46,320 Where else could you find a 21,000 enthusiastic individuals who will go out and market your business on your behalf? 607 01:00:46,920 --> 01:00:54,210 So I come back to my final point, which is really around networks, around exploiting the networks that you have, making them work for you, 608 01:00:54,420 --> 01:01:00,870 extending them, cultivating them, using some of the more cost effective mechanisms to keep in touch with those networks. 609 01:01:01,410 --> 01:01:08,760 And that's the way in which I think small and medium sized businesses can be successful in their creating and cultivating of customers. 610 01:01:09,600 --> 01:01:14,549 And there are a few final points about being good at marketing in order to finish my final minute, 611 01:01:14,550 --> 01:01:20,490 just with some further reading these you've got an handout, just a couple of books you might want to look at. 612 01:01:21,300 --> 01:01:25,230 In particular, if you're interested in using the Internet for marketing, 613 01:01:25,470 --> 01:01:31,680 then Dave Chafee's book is extremely worthwhile to look at in terms of practical 614 01:01:31,680 --> 01:01:34,860 strategies and those of you interested professional service activities, 615 01:01:34,860 --> 01:01:39,510 business services. Laura Young And then you could look at international markets. 616 01:01:40,020 --> 01:01:47,010 The text there is national marketing is really one of the best designed around the needs of small firms, but actually what this stuff is electronic. 617 01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:55,770 So I'd recommend highly a great blog by a guy called James Jenks on it's called Duct Tape Marketing, which speaks for itself. 618 01:01:55,770 --> 01:01:59,190 It's about making mend marketing in some senses on a small budget. 619 01:01:59,700 --> 01:02:08,220 It's a great ideas in there. And then if you're interested in slightly higher tech or social marketing than national business, it's worth looking at. 620 01:02:08,730 --> 01:02:13,500 And then Dave Chap his own website where he brings together a range of digital marketing experts. 621 01:02:13,500 --> 01:02:20,550 Again, free to air is smart insights. So there are three really useful electronic resources that you can use. 622 01:02:21,150 --> 01:02:25,110 So I start the formal section there. I think we have time for questions now. 623 01:02:25,110 --> 01:02:34,290 We're off to How would you like so? Well, we will adjourn now for, I think, a drink and we're happy to talk to know a lot of questions that point. 624 01:02:34,680 --> 01:02:37,490 But thank you for your patience and your interesting.