ARI: Hello, I'm Ari. [CLAUDINE: And I'm Claudine] Welcome to Proving the Negative.
ARI: We're a podcast all about exploring the different sides of cybersecurity,
from political to computer science, international relations to mathematics.
Join us as we talk to our friends about the work they do.
If you're looking for new ways to think about security, we're the podcast for you.
CLAUDINE: We are your hosts, Arianna and Claudine,
we will talk to cybersecurity researchers about the problems they tackle.
ARI: Here at PTNPod we keep the message positive and proactive!
CLAUDINE: Ari we should probably explain - what IS a black swan exactly?
ARI: For anyone paying attention to our branding, we use black swans...
Black swans have been used to illustrate different ways of thinking. Nassim Nicholas Taleb wrote "Black Swans".
He talks about black swans as events, and these events have three properties.
The first is that they're difficult to predict. The second is that they're high impact.
So there's usually a big consequence. Third, we could see the events coming.
The 2008 crisis is a black swan. Nassim Taleb talks about medieval England:
Instead of "when pigs fly", it was "you'll see a black swan before that happens".
No one had been to Australia. No one had seen black swans.
A lot of folks won't deal with cybersecurity issues (but they exist and can have a big impact).
The other is a philosophical problem. Going for a walk in England, no black swans.
They're not native. Say go for a walk and see a swan - a white one.
I might generalise that all swans are white, and that's just not true.
There's a problem in assuming the future will turn out just like the past has done.
For me, black swans represent the idea that we can do things differently.
As an example - just because we've seen companies hoovering up personal data,
it doesn't mean that that's how we have to build systems, moving forwards.
It does require a re-think about what we know, what we do and how we do it.
This isn't really about the swans, it's what they represent. We also like the aesthetic.
If you can think of any examples, do send them in!
What can our listeners expect in upcoming episodes?
CLAUDINE: If you're interested in some of the dangers that kids online face,
we are going to be talking to someone about that.
If your bag is International Relations and intrigue we're going to cover that as well.
Online hate groups... ARI: Let's tell people about the CDT.
CLAUDINE: The Centre for Doctoral Training in Cyber Security, University of Oxford.
There are now several CDTs across the country.
The goal of the programme is to be interdisciplinary and to include people
with a wide array of backgrounds into the programme for diverse perspectives.
ARI: Why did we start this podcast? CLAUDINE: There were a couple of reasons.
Certainly when I started, I had no idea of the breadth of work that was being done.
I imagined a lot more of it would be 'traditional' of cybersecurity.
Hacking, network security or penetration testing.
I never considered fields like International Relations, Law, Sociology or Education.
It was a real shame that they weren't part of the mainstream conversation,
I thought a podcast to talk about that would broaden horizons a little bit.
ARI: I would add - I've been to a lot of research talks (where I'd fall asleep).
Engagement is a really important skill, and I wanted to do more of that.
CLAUDINE: Research means using specific academic language that means nothing,
to anyone outside your field. ARI: This podcast is an engagement tool.
Showcasing work and exposing people to new ideas around cyber security.
Also, I get to work with you, Claudine. You do a lot of advocacy and development...
It's a chance for me to talk to you more, really.
CLAUDINE: We are first time podcasters, it's a good way to get perspective.
Ari, your work on data rights etc. is stuff I was really glad to know more about.
ARI: What can our listeners expect in the coming episodes? Any tidbits?
CLAUDINE: We tried to run the gamut this series. We have fun with our guests,
we asked for elevator pitches, how they approach challenges, any surprises...
and what they would investigate if they had all the money in the world to do so.
Finally, we asked for tips for anyone who would like to keep up with cyber security.
We asked our guests what cyber security is and how they would define it.
We were surprised by how different answers were. That just shows how broad
cyber security has become. A little background on us...
My background is actually not in Computer Science at all.
My background is in Law and Political Science. I did a pretty big 180 in...
What I look at is the effect social media has on individual well-being...
why users have the reactions that they have to social media content,
which seems like an obvious question,
but is difficult and feeds into questions about control and social media use.
How about you? ARI: My background has been fairly traditional.
I started off in Computer Science, networks focused, blinking lights...
Even at that point you have to think about password policies...
how people use your systems, what purpose do these networks serve?
My research has been about building trust - this is key to systems that last.
Think about longer term impact and human needs...
We are going to have our own episodes later on. Stay tuned, we'll geek out!
In the meantime, you can tweet at us @HelloPTNPod.
If you're just on the edge of your seat, subscribe to our podcast.
Our show is PTNPod. Ari, what do people do if they are not on Twitter?
ARI: Well, if you are not on Twitter, no problem at all.
You can ping us an email at ptnegative@cs.ox.ac.uk
We would love a good review... notes, questions, anything you want to talk about.
Please get in touch. We'd love to hear it. Thanks for listening, we'll see you next time.
CLAUDINE: Bye, everyone. This has been a podcast from the Centre for Doctoral Training in Cyber Security,
University of Oxford. Funded by the Engineering and Physical Sciences Research Council.