1 00:00:01,660 --> 00:00:20,000 He was. Welcome, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the fifth annual Ralph Dondo Memorial Lecture. 2 00:00:20,270 --> 00:00:27,650 I'm delighted to welcome several members of the Don to a family again to this event. 3 00:00:29,090 --> 00:00:39,290 And I would also like to acknowledge the representatives of the Site Foundation, which generously supports this lecture and colloquium, 4 00:00:39,830 --> 00:00:46,460 the Fred Ord Foundation and the Aurora Foundation, which supports the work of the Don of Program. 5 00:00:48,240 --> 00:01:01,860 Rose Standoff was a German sociologist who went on to become a public intellectual, deeply engaged in both European and global debates. 6 00:01:03,090 --> 00:01:12,329 So it's particularly fitting that our speaker today is a German sociologist who went on to become a public intellectual, 7 00:01:12,330 --> 00:01:16,380 deeply engaged in European and global debates. 8 00:01:16,410 --> 00:01:24,600 Professor Ulrich Beck is probably the Germany's leading sociologist today. 9 00:01:24,990 --> 00:01:29,730 He holds positions at the University of Munich and at the LSC and in Paris. 10 00:01:30,510 --> 00:01:37,350 He will forgive me, I'm sure, if I don't list all his publications, positions, titles and honours. 11 00:01:38,190 --> 00:01:47,190 But he became best known originally for coining and defining the term risk society. 12 00:01:48,210 --> 00:01:52,380 His work has covered topics such as reflexive modernisation, 13 00:01:53,130 --> 00:02:03,360 as you will hear cosmopolitanism and cosmopolitan ization and cosmopolitan risk communities. 14 00:02:04,290 --> 00:02:10,440 But he particularly became. 15 00:02:11,500 --> 00:02:18,340 The person to do this is John Dorf, lecturer, because of his engagement in the European debate, 16 00:02:18,790 --> 00:02:31,690 notably with a book called Challenging Labour German Europe, published in Germany in 2012 and in England in English in 2013. 17 00:02:33,220 --> 00:02:37,990 A notion, by the way, which he treats with some scepticism, I hasten to add, 18 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:47,889 he has been deeply engaged with a Spinelli group in mobilising support for the European Union, 19 00:02:47,890 --> 00:02:50,920 and so it's particularly fitting that he should be our lecturer. 20 00:02:51,400 --> 00:03:02,260 Just a few weeks before some highly contested elections to the European Parliament, our first respondent is our own Professor Kalypso Nicolaides, 21 00:03:02,260 --> 00:03:10,270 Professor of International Relations, former director of the European Studies Centre here, director of the Centre for International Studies, 22 00:03:11,410 --> 00:03:15,430 one of this country's leading experts on the European Union and federalism, 23 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:25,840 and in particular someone who has coined and advanced the notion of European democracy, 24 00:03:26,530 --> 00:03:32,680 the more the plural of demos, something that she will explain more about and share in the discussion. 25 00:03:33,490 --> 00:03:43,750 She was also a member of the Reflection Group chaired by Felipe Gonzalez, commissioned by the European Council to look at Europe 2030. 26 00:03:44,710 --> 00:03:54,940 In English, we tend to tour such groups, groups of wise men, but that would not be entirely appropriate for calypso. 27 00:03:55,240 --> 00:04:00,820 But the French wonder to say a group decide. So she is our sage for today. 28 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:10,270 And Lord Hannay, our second respondent, is one of Britain's most distinguished retired diplomats. 29 00:04:10,570 --> 00:04:22,300 He was actually a first secretary on the negotiating team, which negotiated Britain's entry to work within the European communities. 30 00:04:22,780 --> 00:04:33,190 He was Britain's permanent representative to the European communities in the late 1980s and to the UN in the early 1990s. 31 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:39,220 He has been extremely active in British European debates ever since. 32 00:04:39,220 --> 00:04:50,350 He is a board member of the Centre for European Reform and very importantly, he's a member of the House of Lords EU Select Committee. 33 00:04:51,160 --> 00:05:01,780 And while the House of Lords might possibly not be absolutely the most democratic of second chamber in the European Union, 34 00:05:02,410 --> 00:05:09,820 it is actually one that does some of the most effective scrutiny of EU legislation. 35 00:05:10,630 --> 00:05:14,830 And it's a committee, by the way, on which Ralph Randolph also sat for many years. 36 00:05:15,670 --> 00:05:20,290 So he is a very close and supremely well qualified. 37 00:05:23,260 --> 00:05:31,899 Respondent to Professor Beck. Professor Beck will speak for about 30 to 40 minutes or respondents will speak for about 5 to 8 minutes, 38 00:05:31,900 --> 00:05:34,770 and then there'll be plenty of time for discussion. 39 00:05:34,780 --> 00:05:43,720 So please join me in welcoming Ulrik back to deliver this year's Don Dorf lecture on the Cosmopolitan Outlook. 40 00:05:44,500 --> 00:05:47,500 How the European Project Can Be Saved. 41 00:05:59,820 --> 00:06:05,730 Ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much for this warm welcome. 42 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:10,200 It's quite an honour, an opportunity, a challenge, 43 00:06:10,740 --> 00:06:23,400 maybe even a risk to talk to such a sophisticated audience and such a sophisticated building on the issue of Europe. 44 00:06:23,610 --> 00:06:29,970 In honour of those times of in my standoff lecture, 45 00:06:30,540 --> 00:06:37,710 I put centre stage the standoff question How can Europe ensure peace and freedom 46 00:06:38,130 --> 00:06:42,960 for its citizens in the face of old and new threats in the 21st century? 47 00:06:43,590 --> 00:06:53,520 And in this way? Or to win the support of the youth of Euro sceptical European citizens for a new European Dream. 48 00:06:54,720 --> 00:07:10,350 To borrow Churchill's formula already years ago, Don of asked the question I'm going to discuss today here who actually speaks the language of Europe? 49 00:07:11,910 --> 00:07:24,700 Who is the European weak? Blizzards, Strasbourg, Berlin or finally, the citizens of Europe, after all. 50 00:07:26,770 --> 00:07:31,330 Europe is one thing for sure. It's a moving target. 51 00:07:33,190 --> 00:07:36,580 Another change in priority is taking place as we speak. 52 00:07:37,420 --> 00:07:46,600 It's the present historical moment. The defining issue in European politics is no longer the EU or bail out policy, 53 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:54,220 but instead the confrontation with a nuclear armed Russia and the upcoming European elections. 54 00:07:55,650 --> 00:08:04,350 In May, the EU could once again appeal to the voters as a force for peace and not as a money guzzling bureaucratic monster. 55 00:08:04,350 --> 00:08:14,340 At least so in the Eastern Post Soviet Union countries, and maybe in Finland and Sweden, for example, as well. 56 00:08:15,030 --> 00:08:19,260 So let us start with the simple Dondo question. 57 00:08:19,740 --> 00:08:25,799 Who speaks the language of Europe? My answer is I five SEISS. 58 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:26,670 First SEISS. 59 00:08:28,350 --> 00:08:38,640 We have a huge problem in defining what Europe is actually about, and this is an embarrassing problem that so many years of talking about Europe. 60 00:08:39,750 --> 00:08:47,360 Europe is essentially a moving target. It is not a fixed condition. 61 00:08:48,350 --> 00:08:52,940 Europe is not a territorial unit. Europe is not a state. 62 00:08:53,570 --> 00:08:56,900 Europe is not a nation writ large. Europe is not. 63 00:08:57,020 --> 00:09:03,410 Not. Not actually. There isn't really Europe. 64 00:09:04,550 --> 00:09:13,360 There's only Europeanisation. There's only a process, a process of ongoing transformation. 65 00:09:13,790 --> 00:09:17,510 And even the term transformation maybe isn't quite right for it. 66 00:09:17,540 --> 00:09:29,779 I'm in Germany. I would use the term for the Anglo Metamorphoses, which might be a better word as I define it with Europeanisation. 67 00:09:29,780 --> 00:09:34,640 It metamorphoses, I mean a politics of scientific. 68 00:09:36,180 --> 00:09:43,920 European politics and society did not emerge in an open stage in New York political act, but evolved as a regime of side effect. 69 00:09:45,030 --> 00:09:51,360 The trademark of this trait side effects history of the EU is its fundamental ambivalence. 70 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:56,399 On the one hand, its reflects the least if anomalous. 71 00:09:56,400 --> 00:10:05,760 Hegel would have called it a cunning of reason that enabled Europe to step out of the long, shadowy shadow cast by its bloody history. 72 00:10:06,510 --> 00:10:12,000 On the other hand, as Europe of Scientifics is something that nobody really intended and authorised, 73 00:10:12,870 --> 00:10:21,240 but nevertheless turns people's life lives upside down and thus provokes national and ethnic resistance. 74 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:30,660 The development of the EU occurred through the transnational cooperation of elites with their own criteria of rationality, 75 00:10:31,230 --> 00:10:35,970 largely independent of national politics, interests and political convictions. 76 00:10:37,670 --> 00:10:41,149 Be Who is the actor of Europeanisation? 77 00:10:41,150 --> 00:10:48,140 His transformation, the invention of Europe was a product not of the public deliberation and democratic procedures, 78 00:10:48,470 --> 00:10:54,890 but of you would you would ditch your precepts, prescriptions and practices. 79 00:10:55,400 --> 00:11:00,710 It was a European Court of Justice, which, in accordance was a self-definition, 80 00:11:01,190 --> 00:11:13,820 elevated the European Founding Treaties to the Status of Constitutional Carta Charter in two leading decisions in 1963 and 64. 81 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:20,629 Consequently, a European law emerged that claims constitutional priority, 82 00:11:20,630 --> 00:11:27,620 which it was duly accepted and acknowledged as such by the key actors in European public. 83 00:11:27,690 --> 00:11:34,129 So if you are asked what actually is the core of Europe, it's a European law as in as an actor. 84 00:11:34,130 --> 00:11:41,360 And to be sure, it is not the image of the bureaucracy which we are always talking this monster, 85 00:11:41,570 --> 00:11:48,670 which everybody has in mind, because actually there is a very specific way of implementing those laws. 86 00:11:48,680 --> 00:11:52,610 It's not implemented by Europe. It's implemented by the nation states himself. 87 00:11:53,300 --> 00:11:54,950 This is a specific construction. 88 00:11:55,490 --> 00:12:06,230 So we have to realise this structure and not not only have the often wrong image, which is so much in the public perception. 89 00:12:09,190 --> 00:12:13,930 See where then did the power of transformation come from? 90 00:12:16,290 --> 00:12:24,690 The power of European metathesis was and is an answer to the anthropological shock and horror of the Second World War. 91 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:30,480 Then, by a kind of normative horizon, emerged. 92 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:36,600 Never again. Holocaust. Sharp look at the history of world. 93 00:12:37,020 --> 00:12:40,320 Which society demonstrates the power of this dynamics? 94 00:12:40,860 --> 00:12:44,310 When Hiroshima happened, no one understood nuclear weapons. 95 00:12:44,790 --> 00:12:55,710 But afterwards, the worldwide shock of the violation of ethical foundations of humanity has created a normative horizon and expectation. 96 00:12:55,920 --> 00:13:09,780 Never again, Hiroshima, which till today, is the background for the politics of disarmament in all its conflicts and problematic. 97 00:13:10,260 --> 00:13:14,910 In the meantime, there have many occasions like this came up. 98 00:13:16,430 --> 00:13:23,219 Never again not be. Never Again 911 Never Again. 99 00:13:23,220 --> 00:13:31,200 Fukushima Never Again. Global Financial Crisis Always this kind of anthropological shock, 100 00:13:31,740 --> 00:13:39,600 which totally contradicts our expectations not only politically but theoretically as well, 101 00:13:39,990 --> 00:13:49,620 and creates a normative horizon for changes and thereby pushing for regime change in national, international politics and law. 102 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,910 The latest example of this is the digital freedom risk, 103 00:13:54,360 --> 00:14:01,050 which has only become public visible by the courage of one man at that photo, Snowden the whistleblower. 104 00:14:01,350 --> 00:14:14,130 To me, this is an existential, self-inflicted threat to the Western idea of liberty, and I'm very much missing five kind of voice in this affair. 105 00:14:16,380 --> 00:14:20,790 D We are now in a new stage of European metaphysics, 106 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:30,330 which the Financial Times two weeks ago celebrated on the front page with the headline Super Juiced Super Tuesday for EU Bank Regulation. 107 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:39,550 A bank regulation is an answer to a never again financial catastrophe. 108 00:14:42,890 --> 00:14:49,220 I was taught I was using the term 999 and my book converter society. 109 00:14:49,610 --> 00:14:53,840 I was using the term financial Chernobyl. 110 00:14:54,960 --> 00:15:04,050 And when I when I used to write about conscience because I thought this is actually over estimating overstretching the point. 111 00:15:04,410 --> 00:15:09,780 But what I had in mind is pretty much what what happened 2008 and and today. 112 00:15:12,200 --> 00:15:20,600 The anticipation of another financial catastrophe is creating an enormous appetite for financial legislation. 113 00:15:21,020 --> 00:15:27,530 Europe's banking union is a project of regime change, as the Financial Times has put it, 114 00:15:27,890 --> 00:15:38,570 pooling power and money unmatched since the creation of the single currency, taxpayers no longer first in line to bail out banks. 115 00:15:38,810 --> 00:15:43,460 Governments are no longer solely masters of their banks, etc., etc. 116 00:15:44,210 --> 00:15:48,920 And by the way, Britain has already lost its way to power in Europe. 117 00:15:50,670 --> 00:15:57,880 Second thesis, the anticipation of financial catastrophe changed the European landscape of power. 118 00:15:57,930 --> 00:16:03,630 Fundamentally, we can observe three shifts in power. 119 00:16:04,990 --> 00:16:10,960 First, it's a division between eurozone nations and EU nations. 120 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:18,610 Now all the politics because of the crisis, is concentrated in the eurozone nations, 121 00:16:19,330 --> 00:16:23,410 and the prime ministers who are not part of the eurozone have to leave. 122 00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:28,330 This is a very embarrassing situation. I have to leave the room when the real meat comes on the table. 123 00:16:29,500 --> 00:16:33,850 And this is true for Cameroon as well. 124 00:16:35,110 --> 00:16:38,600 So Britain. It's. 125 00:16:41,430 --> 00:16:44,430 Actually maybe the country. 126 00:16:47,010 --> 00:16:58,360 Which is the greatest victim. Of the division between the eurozone countries and countries that merely are members of the EU. 127 00:17:00,060 --> 00:17:03,510 Thinking in terms of policy is toward the moment of decision. 128 00:17:03,780 --> 00:17:10,890 In my mind, for Britain is not an in-out referendum in the relation to the European Union, 129 00:17:11,430 --> 00:17:19,770 but a different kind of decision either regaining power by becoming a member of the eurozone or out. 130 00:17:21,410 --> 00:17:30,420 The question then is what does it mean? And I think this is actually the Achilles heel of the US sceptic position. 131 00:17:30,990 --> 00:17:35,280 I wonder if they have any plan A or B for the review of. 132 00:17:37,910 --> 00:17:45,860 The total with to all from the EU entails departure from the world largest single market. 133 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:49,900 With Fatal Consequence. Nobody really can want this. 134 00:17:51,550 --> 00:17:55,480 The model many Tories seem to have in mind. 135 00:17:55,870 --> 00:18:05,140 Britain retaining access to internal market but being exempted from most of the EU laws, including free movement. 136 00:18:05,500 --> 00:18:15,410 It's a political fantasy. To put it in ironical terms, it's very difficult for a German professor to be ironical. 137 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:17,989 Therefore, and therefore I'm mentioning it, 138 00:18:17,990 --> 00:18:30,530 that to combat climate change and flooding of the British island by leaving the EU may not be the right answer. 139 00:18:31,820 --> 00:18:35,660 And leaving the EU doesn't really fix the national health system either. 140 00:18:37,390 --> 00:18:46,330 Along this line we have to realise saving the EU and saving Britain's future is intimately interconnected. 141 00:18:49,970 --> 00:18:56,720 Second inside of the euro countries is a second division between creditor and debt generations. 142 00:18:57,260 --> 00:19:03,770 This is a very important relationship and actually in social scientists didn't think much about this relationship, 143 00:19:04,010 --> 00:19:08,120 which is getting such an important dynamic for social inequalities, 144 00:19:08,300 --> 00:19:12,620 which you cannot think in class categories because it involves all kind of 145 00:19:12,620 --> 00:19:19,489 countries and then even uprise and down grading of whole countries and classes. 146 00:19:19,490 --> 00:19:23,660 So it's a completely new dynamic. It's not a new dynamic, 147 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:30,559 but it's not something which we actually have one on on this on on on us between 148 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:40,520 so far idiomatic of have opened up at the AP centre of the crisis crisis written 149 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:45,200 states of the eurozone in particular between those countries that are on the drip 150 00:19:45,500 --> 00:19:50,720 provided by the rescue funds and those countries that are financing the bailout. 151 00:19:51,770 --> 00:19:57,379 Third, the consequence of this is the economically most powerful country. 152 00:19:57,380 --> 00:20:03,130 Germany becomes a politically most powerful country. 153 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:13,430 This way, the kind of accidental empire of a German Europe has has emerged. 154 00:20:14,540 --> 00:20:20,830 The German chancellor, Angela merkel, is practising a new style of politics, power, politics in Europe. 155 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:27,080 I call it naturalism. It's a combination of much heavily in macro. 156 00:20:29,330 --> 00:20:38,090 My book is about this, by the way, that the Germans think Machiavelli is actually an insult to America. 157 00:20:38,330 --> 00:20:44,990 And I gave a lecture in France last year here. 158 00:20:45,470 --> 00:20:50,600 I learned that they see Machiavelli as an insight too much. 159 00:20:56,510 --> 00:21:03,720 Thesis Europeanisation is politics of scientific has created a Europe without Europeans. 160 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,490 And to you a crisis has victimised the European citizens. 161 00:21:10,090 --> 00:21:13,990 So now anti-European revolution is rocking Europe. 162 00:21:14,580 --> 00:21:24,159 I Our findings in my research centre on Reflexive Modernisation five years ago already gave us this picture. 163 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:29,410 I didn't believe it. I didn't believe it. But they already found out that this is the case. 164 00:21:30,580 --> 00:21:34,899 The anti-European movements instrumentalized the contradiction of Europeanisation 165 00:21:34,900 --> 00:21:40,360 as politics of side effects and the new imperialistic power structure of the EU. 166 00:21:40,510 --> 00:21:48,910 The US sentiment is not only directed against Muslims and other foreign elements, but against the so-called liberal elites. 167 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:54,850 They are the ones who, in the opinion of many, are destroying national identity. 168 00:21:54,970 --> 00:22:00,310 These elites are also the ones who allowed the cities to be overflowed. 169 00:22:00,310 --> 00:22:03,370 It was foreigners that are legal or illegal. 170 00:22:03,370 --> 00:22:06,460 They are the ones who created the European Union. 171 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:15,520 This demonic, demonic abstraction, as well as the welfare state in which the outsiders are now making this selfish whole. 172 00:22:16,900 --> 00:22:23,200 But in order to understand the move, the movements of anti-European sentiments, much differentiation is needed. 173 00:22:23,500 --> 00:22:31,990 The research which has been conducted as well. My Centre uncovers the following paradox and that I find this very interesting. 174 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:37,870 EU scepticism grows with the Europeanisation of everyday life. 175 00:22:39,500 --> 00:22:51,260 People are actually enjoying Europe, being mobile in Europe, taking the advantages of Europe, but at the same time vote against personnel in Europe. 176 00:22:51,590 --> 00:23:04,520 This is, I think of quite an interesting result, which makes us think about fourth SEISS But how can you overcome this crisis of coexistence? 177 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:14,300 The empowerment of democratic institutions is necessary, but it's not a sufficient condition. 178 00:23:15,830 --> 00:23:18,950 I think the question, which has not been really asked so far, 179 00:23:18,950 --> 00:23:29,840 neither from from in the political discussion nor in the social sciences, what does it mean for the individual? 180 00:23:31,190 --> 00:23:34,580 How does the individual profit from Europe? 181 00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:41,900 What what more emancipation comes from Europe to the individual? 182 00:23:42,770 --> 00:23:48,270 I actually discussed this in my in my book. So I'm not going to repeat it here. 183 00:23:53,760 --> 00:24:06,300 The German doctor. Actually, the question is how does this metaphysics of national citizenship to a European. 184 00:24:07,540 --> 00:24:11,650 Citizenship to self-understanding. Participation of the individual. 185 00:24:11,860 --> 00:24:25,660 In Europe, hope becomes this possible. The German view of is counterproductive in this age, but perhaps a vision of a mediterranean Europe would work. 186 00:24:26,450 --> 00:24:29,779 Or picking up on those question who is a European? 187 00:24:29,780 --> 00:24:42,020 We not only of mainly the United States of Europe, but also of mainly the united regions of Europe or the United Cities of Europe. 188 00:24:43,360 --> 00:24:53,830 A large proportion of the EU are critics and anti-Europeans who are now raising the voices of prisoners of the outdated national nostalgia. 189 00:24:54,340 --> 00:25:02,980 This is how, for example, the French intellectual Alain to Alan Finkel, called Arduous Europe, 190 00:25:03,370 --> 00:25:09,520 thought that it could constitute itself without or even against the nations it wanted. 191 00:25:09,550 --> 00:25:13,840 It wanted to punish the nations for the horrors of the 20th century. 192 00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:19,270 But there is no post-national democracy. Democracy is monolingual. 193 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:28,030 If it is to function, it needs a shared language and shared life responses and its shared project. 194 00:25:28,810 --> 00:25:33,760 We do not come into the world as world citizens. Human communities have limits. 195 00:25:34,270 --> 00:25:44,320 Europe does not take this into account. This is why the European public cannot work up any enthusiasm for the European Union. 196 00:25:44,350 --> 00:25:48,670 This is how thinker, quote, argued in a discussion I had with him. 197 00:25:50,020 --> 00:25:59,650 But this criticism of Europe is based on the National Delusion that a return to the nation state, a deal is possible in the world at risk. 198 00:26:00,580 --> 00:26:09,460 It proves presupposes a national horizon as a diagnostic framework for Europe's present and future. 199 00:26:10,330 --> 00:26:18,729 To this critics, I say broaden your outlook and then you will see that not only just in Europe but in the whole world is 200 00:26:18,730 --> 00:26:27,910 a process of transition where the boundaries of European political thinking are no longer even real. 201 00:26:28,570 --> 00:26:31,600 And this is relevant for the social sciences as well, 202 00:26:31,990 --> 00:26:38,380 because the social scientists are to some extent prisoners of what I call methodological nationalism. 203 00:26:38,710 --> 00:26:45,160 All the concepts, all our ideas of of unit, of research, all are defined nationally. 204 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,390 And when you have, for example, in the discussion with small. 205 00:26:49,390 --> 00:27:02,350 Eizenstat a few years ago, you said, well, why are the social sciences so much fixed and so much occupied by this national perspective? 206 00:27:02,830 --> 00:27:06,010 Because, you know, there has been all kind of plurality before. 207 00:27:06,190 --> 00:27:09,700 It's only 150 years. And now there is a new plurality coming up. 208 00:27:09,910 --> 00:27:17,830 How is it possible that science, with so much reflection, is only a mainly dominated by the national view? 209 00:27:20,290 --> 00:27:30,999 We need a cosmopolitan outlook just to understand what is happening here now in in all kind of areas of of in Britain and in Germany, 210 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:34,570 in the cities, in in all in all the different issues, 211 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:41,830 all nations are faced with a new cultural plurality, not only as a result of migration, 212 00:27:41,830 --> 00:27:48,280 but also of Internet communication, climate change, fuel crisis, digital threats to freedom, etc., etc. 213 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:56,410 People of the most diverse backgrounds with different languages, conceptions of values and religions are living and working alongside each other. 214 00:27:56,740 --> 00:28:03,340 Their children are attending the same school and then trying to become established the same legal and political system. 215 00:28:03,820 --> 00:28:13,030 This is what I call the fact of cosmopolitan zation in opposition to the you mentioned is already to the fullest philosophical norm, 216 00:28:13,030 --> 00:28:19,850 a tradition of cosmopolitanism. It's difficult to to find the new words for those new situation. 217 00:28:19,870 --> 00:28:27,790 We can, of course, talk about if this views it. This selection of work is a correct one, if it really works. 218 00:28:28,030 --> 00:28:35,470 But important is to realise that we live in a world where the seemingly excluded other is included. 219 00:28:35,740 --> 00:28:43,120 This cosmopolitan zation I define as an enforced inclusion of the excluded other. 220 00:28:43,990 --> 00:28:52,330 And this is happening in relation to climate change because actors or who are producing this are in a completely different world. 221 00:28:52,570 --> 00:28:57,940 But we and others are affected by it or it's with the financial crisis the same thing. 222 00:28:58,270 --> 00:29:07,960 Migration, of course, was a good example. Households, if you look at non-U.S. working households, this is actually one of the main pictures of wealth. 223 00:29:08,590 --> 00:29:14,500 Cosmopolitan is Asian because mothers from different countries are working at the same time here and there. 224 00:29:15,550 --> 00:29:26,890 And football today, a match, maybe some of you, not between Bayern Munich and Real Madrid during the time we have this discussion. 225 00:29:27,250 --> 00:29:31,930 And of course by invention would not be by a mention of all the people come from by on and mentioned, 226 00:29:33,050 --> 00:29:37,330 you know, they are coming from all over the world. And the same is true was Real Madrid. 227 00:29:37,510 --> 00:29:40,900 I sometimes think, you know, in all the world this is watching it here. 228 00:29:41,140 --> 00:29:44,820 It's a really. Huge Cosmo political event. 229 00:29:45,330 --> 00:29:53,330 I called it the banner of cosmopolitanism, but we shouldn't underestimate it, because if you would be organised like, 230 00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:58,740 like a champion European championship, you know, we would be in a better, better position. 231 00:29:59,010 --> 00:30:02,780 So we maybe could even learn from this kind of cosmopolitan. 232 00:30:04,860 --> 00:30:10,530 But on the other hand, this means cosmopolitanism does not produce cosmopolitans. 233 00:30:12,020 --> 00:30:17,810 It does not produce well citizens. Often the opposite is the case because it's enforced. 234 00:30:18,580 --> 00:30:25,760 Nobody voted on it. It just happens. We seem to be threatened by by all kinds of strangers in all kinds of ways. 235 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:34,220 People are just doing the opposite. They are redefining the national and the ethnic identity as something in which they find secure. 236 00:30:34,790 --> 00:30:39,650 So actually, you couldn't understand even the anti cosmopolitan movement and sentiments. 237 00:30:39,980 --> 00:30:43,150 Just from a national point of view. Formative. 238 00:30:43,530 --> 00:30:47,650 If you if you talk about it in epistemological terms, factually, 239 00:30:47,700 --> 00:30:58,210 you need a different perspective of of book, of observation, of observer perspective in order to analyse. 240 00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:17,200 Well, I actually was trying to discuss the relationship to to the intervention of of Russia into Ukraine in this direction. 241 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:30,670 Because the interesting point is actually that I think in this situation add to that see a clash of two understandings of nationhood. 242 00:31:31,780 --> 00:31:41,740 Happens in in in Europe maybe in other parts of the country as well this ethnic territorial definition of of the nation. 243 00:31:42,340 --> 00:31:46,690 Where were the motto? The background motto is where Russians live. 244 00:31:46,690 --> 00:31:53,350 There is Russia. That's a Russian state, but it's just an ethnic, territorial definition. 245 00:31:53,590 --> 00:32:01,720 And I think in in the West, we have a different not so much reflected way of of, let's say, of of a cosmopolitan nationhood, 246 00:32:02,500 --> 00:32:09,879 of a nationhood which understands itself not by closure, not by ethnic definition, 247 00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:15,250 but by plurality at the same time, struggles for some kind of of identity. 248 00:32:15,970 --> 00:32:30,850 And in in. I would say there are two different principle for declarations here in this clash of of nation understanding of nations. 249 00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:38,500 One is the Declaration of Independence, which is actually still if you listen to all the discussion, 250 00:32:38,510 --> 00:32:45,850 for example, in Turkey and in Russia, in in in many other parts of the world, this is the big issue. 251 00:32:46,420 --> 00:32:49,570 But on the other hand, we have the declaration of interdependence, 252 00:32:50,140 --> 00:33:02,410 which says all to to cope with the challenges of of of of the global age and all the problems we have of interconnected. 253 00:33:02,410 --> 00:33:11,650 This interdependence is a condition for redefining sovereignty and redefining nationhood. 254 00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:17,420 Well, time is running. 255 00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:34,080 Well, we had we talked so much about the German Europe, but and of course, there's lots of discussion to to the Brussels Europe. 256 00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:43,940 But what is actually the antidote? What is the counter perspective at all to those visions of the future of Europe? 257 00:33:45,020 --> 00:33:51,140 It could be the united regions of Europe or to be more specific, 258 00:33:51,260 --> 00:33:58,880 the vision of a Southern Europe, for example, the dream of a mediterranean wedding bit, 259 00:33:59,060 --> 00:34:11,570 as Michel Chevalier named it, already in the 19th century, in which north and south and east and west would make love. 260 00:34:11,570 --> 00:34:21,590 As he said, the seemingly necessary link between the state, nation, national identity and a single language would be dissolved. 261 00:34:22,580 --> 00:34:29,120 The union, the member state and the regions consume themselves at different levels with the welfare of the citizens. 262 00:34:29,780 --> 00:34:33,680 They lend to citizens on the one hand to voice in the globalised world. 263 00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:39,950 Why giving them on the other a sense of regional security and identity this way? 264 00:34:41,130 --> 00:34:47,410 Their most creative. Put is becoming a demo. 265 00:34:48,310 --> 00:34:53,350 Crazy as he was, as he would say. I think this is a beautiful way of putting it. 266 00:34:53,920 --> 00:35:04,329 The multi-level, pluralist, pluralistic affair to define democracy Mediterranean culture is Savio. 267 00:35:04,330 --> 00:35:13,450 LEEB It is a world of contradictory certainties, indifference, despair, distrust, beauty and hope. 268 00:35:13,780 --> 00:35:19,450 That's a mixture that we, northern Europeans romanticise as the gardens of the souls. 269 00:35:20,550 --> 00:35:28,140 Body tone in bloom, where lemon trees bloom and corruption to some extent. 270 00:35:29,370 --> 00:35:38,100 But isn't it true that nevertheless, if the Germans had gone to school with ball players of the South, 271 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:42,090 they would never have plunged the world into the Second World War. 272 00:35:43,550 --> 00:35:50,530 Fifth thesis. Why should the European project being saved in the first place? 273 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:56,760 What is the purpose of the European Union in the 21st century? 274 00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,810 Is there any purpose? Why you would. 275 00:36:01,810 --> 00:36:09,800 Why not? The whole world. Why not do it alone in Germany, the UK or France? 276 00:36:10,670 --> 00:36:20,350 There are three answers. In this respect, summarising my lecture first the success story of the European Union. 277 00:36:20,350 --> 00:36:27,660 If you asked what is actually the success of the European Union, it's about how enemies become nature, become neighbours. 278 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:35,090 Navies, not French neighbours, were all neighbours who dislike each other or kind of naval ships. 279 00:36:35,330 --> 00:36:40,910 But they are not enemies. And I think this is in the in the background of the history. 280 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:49,429 Unbelievable. It's a miracle, actually. And it's we thought this is already something which we can count on. 281 00:36:49,430 --> 00:36:57,140 But now we see even the aggression, the Russian aggression makes us realise how fragile even this idea could become. 282 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:12,180 As I sit here comes up the clash of of two understandings of of nation, the cosmopolitan nation, 283 00:37:12,180 --> 00:37:23,100 the European nation, the nation which is in many ways related to the outside world and the ethnic nation. 284 00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:38,040 And actually the notion of the cosmopolitan nation is related to what the American intellectual and of Bern envisioned as early as 1918, 285 00:37:38,310 --> 00:37:42,450 that the American nationalism would become, by necessity, 286 00:37:42,450 --> 00:37:51,270 something very different from the ethnic nationalism of the 20th century Europe by building up what he called the first international nation. 287 00:37:52,380 --> 00:38:04,080 The second purpose is that European modernity, which has been disseminated all over the world, is a suicidal project. 288 00:38:04,740 --> 00:38:09,360 It is actually climate change, financial crisis. 289 00:38:09,630 --> 00:38:19,860 All those things are systematically part of of our modernisation project and are actually threatening the basis of it. 290 00:38:20,940 --> 00:38:29,760 So so actually it's a bit like a car company created a car without any brakes and it started to cause multiple accidents. 291 00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:33,720 The company would take these cars back to redesign them. 292 00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:39,330 And this is exactly what the what you should do with modernity. 293 00:38:40,020 --> 00:38:48,870 We design, we inventing. Modernity could be a specific task for Europe in the 21st century, of course, not only for Europe. 294 00:38:49,830 --> 00:39:01,020 The third point is there's not only the necessity to introduce Demo cratic architecture. 295 00:39:01,410 --> 00:39:05,790 There's an urgent need for Europeanisation from below. 296 00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:14,270 For the creation of a European civil society, internal and external, to the EU, including Russia. 297 00:39:14,540 --> 00:39:18,620 There is no native European citizens citizen. 298 00:39:19,010 --> 00:39:22,730 There is only born national citizens. 299 00:39:23,770 --> 00:39:29,530 So we could create the most beautiful democratic institutions for Europe, 300 00:39:29,530 --> 00:39:36,430 and they will still empty if we don't find a way to change the Europe of side effects into a Europe of the citizen. 301 00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:45,250 This Europeanisation from below has to be empowered by a European by European of the cities. 302 00:39:45,910 --> 00:39:52,899 If you if you once notice the political landscape in Europe, maybe not only in Europe, 303 00:39:52,900 --> 00:40:01,690 but in other parts of the world as well, you find that the nations, to put it directly, mostly black, political conservative. 304 00:40:02,590 --> 00:40:13,600 But the cities are different. They are red, green in in their political perspective, or they do have this more progressive point of view. 305 00:40:13,810 --> 00:40:20,470 And it's interesting to connect the cities as European actors, maybe as global actors as well. 306 00:40:23,450 --> 00:40:32,180 Let me finish by going to implications for social and political theory and research. 307 00:40:35,780 --> 00:40:41,610 In order to understand the transformation, the metaphor for this metaphor, 308 00:40:41,630 --> 00:40:47,240 the safe haven law I'm talking about, which we are experiencing in the world. 309 00:40:47,750 --> 00:40:52,070 We have to make a distinction between two types of social and political feelings. 310 00:40:52,610 --> 00:40:58,339 Those theories will concentrate and focus on the reproduction of social and political 311 00:40:58,340 --> 00:41:07,190 order from those CEOs who focus on the transformation of the political and social order. 312 00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:13,730 And it's amazing, if you look at the basic social and political theories, 313 00:41:13,730 --> 00:41:19,310 all the important ones, they are mainly concentrated on the reproduction of content. 314 00:41:19,910 --> 00:41:26,230 Take, for example, Bourdieu, this theory of class. 315 00:41:26,240 --> 00:41:30,770 Of course he is demonstrating that the variations of class in the 20th century. 316 00:41:31,070 --> 00:41:40,610 But actually his main theory is class society is reproduced even if there have been political changes for all the century or the 20th century. 317 00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:46,910 And we have evidence now that even the 21st century is still a class society in the old sense. 318 00:41:49,010 --> 00:41:56,210 Take for Cool a wonderful, challenging, amazing theoretical system. 319 00:41:56,660 --> 00:41:59,940 But if you look at this point, it's always power. 320 00:41:59,960 --> 00:42:04,040 We can do whatever we want. Power is always there already. 321 00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:07,280 And whatever happens, it's a reproduction of power. 322 00:42:08,060 --> 00:42:15,500 You can even have counterpart reproduction of power. This is his group Luminous, saying that systems are reproduction. 323 00:42:15,500 --> 00:42:20,150 They are not even individuals anymore. They are just systems are reproducing systems. 324 00:42:21,350 --> 00:42:28,549 And you can go on all the big theories about reproduction of all that we don't have many 325 00:42:28,550 --> 00:42:36,320 theories of transformation of for some examples is is for example is especially in Britain, 326 00:42:36,670 --> 00:42:45,020 you could follow Anthony Giddens and others as well, including myself. 327 00:42:49,020 --> 00:42:55,140 In order to understand what is in the kind of dynamics we are in, 328 00:42:55,680 --> 00:43:08,040 we have to we define the basic concepts of social sciences in a frame of reference of transformation and a second consequence. 329 00:43:08,550 --> 00:43:12,030 We need a cosmopolitan turn in the social sciences. 330 00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:19,290 We need to distinguish, as I said before, between cosmopolitanism as a philosophical norm and cosmopolitan position, 331 00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:27,900 as a fact, as a research program in the social and political thought that goes beyond methodological nationalism. 332 00:43:28,290 --> 00:43:34,020 The national outlook is not not only misunderstands the reality of Europeanisation, 333 00:43:34,290 --> 00:43:40,740 etc., but it obscures how breathtaking, exciting social sciences could become again. 334 00:43:41,460 --> 00:43:52,590 The classics we are fascinated by the newly discovered continent called society and reflection of this fascination for which we appear. 335 00:43:53,010 --> 00:43:56,459 If you call your city of exploring, 336 00:43:56,460 --> 00:44:05,190 the unexplored landscape created by the ongoing transformation of the social and political order was to revive the 337 00:44:05,190 --> 00:44:14,490 sociological imagination making sociology and social sciences once again interesting to sociologists and selves. 338 00:44:16,230 --> 00:44:20,490 To other disciplines and to the public and the politics. 339 00:44:21,060 --> 00:44:30,990 Thank you for your. Thank you very much. 340 00:44:31,720 --> 00:44:39,210 Or have a very substantial and wide ranging lecture, I think particularly challenging to Britain, quite apart from the prospect of being flooded. 341 00:44:40,140 --> 00:44:44,670 And to Manchester United, of course, collapsing. Can I go? 342 00:44:57,740 --> 00:45:04,000 Well, Rick, thank you. Thank you for sharing these extremely inspiring ideas with us today. 343 00:45:04,540 --> 00:45:08,890 Europe needs them. But more to the point, we need them. 344 00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:13,510 Ever since Ralph left us, brilliant, 345 00:45:13,540 --> 00:45:22,900 UK friendly pro-EU German intellectuals intimately familiar with both sides of the channels have become an endangered species. 346 00:45:24,580 --> 00:45:28,200 And you are to be nurtured on these eyes. 347 00:45:28,210 --> 00:45:34,780 And I know you've been at LSC, but we are here today to express this this feeling, 348 00:45:35,380 --> 00:45:41,950 and not only by the likes of Clegg, who for whom Continentals with a human face is very precious, 349 00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:52,840 but by all of us EU expats living in the fear of 2017 and who are here in this room and thank God for friends like David and Tim here. 350 00:45:54,220 --> 00:45:58,959 So you will not be surprised that I was particularly intrigued in listening to 351 00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:04,300 you by your desire to win the support of the Euro sceptical European citizens. 352 00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:08,500 Who are these Eurosceptics that you would like to appeal to? 353 00:46:10,540 --> 00:46:16,480 They could be us, of course, because after all, as academics and scholars, we should all be sceptical. 354 00:46:16,690 --> 00:46:24,219 That's our job. But perhaps, perhaps you're thinking about the 350 million or so Europeans who are going to the 355 00:46:24,220 --> 00:46:30,070 polls in three weeks and who might return a partially self-hating European Parliament, 356 00:46:30,070 --> 00:46:39,910 or at least those among the voters and the MEPs who are rational Eurosceptics amenable to the giving of reasons, 357 00:46:39,910 --> 00:46:44,200 the kind of things we do in Oxford and you do in Munich and at LSC. 358 00:46:45,970 --> 00:46:50,590 So I would like to use my full back moment right now, if I may, 359 00:46:50,590 --> 00:46:59,560 to take you up on how your cosmopolitan vision can be soluble in this Europe Eurosceptic ethos of our age. 360 00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:04,300 That's the challenge you've set yourself. If we start with theses number one, 361 00:47:04,300 --> 00:47:10,270 which encapsulate your important credo that you were reminding us at the end that the social science 362 00:47:10,290 --> 00:47:17,560 should resultantly turn their gaze from patterns of reproduction to dynamics of transformation. 363 00:47:18,310 --> 00:47:22,600 Isn't telling the story of European transformation over the last half centuries, 364 00:47:22,930 --> 00:47:27,579 as led by courts and judge and judges, ground to the mill of Eurosceptics? 365 00:47:27,580 --> 00:47:36,250 Isn't it in fact, the case that the European Union has always been a not only since Merkozy, the affair of its democratic government, 366 00:47:36,250 --> 00:47:43,660 and that, as many legal theorists argue, the Luxembourg judges have simply helped write the blueprint from time to time. 367 00:47:43,990 --> 00:47:46,810 Law is politics and through politics. Right? 368 00:47:47,830 --> 00:47:55,659 And then in the story of transformation, can we really say that no one authorised this Europe of side effects, 369 00:47:55,660 --> 00:48:07,960 as you call it, as you so rightly call it? European messianic elites have always believed that they were authorised by their sacred peace mission. 370 00:48:08,980 --> 00:48:13,360 That's what they believe. And problematically, maybe for you. 371 00:48:13,870 --> 00:48:16,180 They often call themselves cosmopolitan. 372 00:48:16,720 --> 00:48:25,300 Myths call themselves cosmopolitan, as I witnessed extensively when I was neither wise nor men of Tim was alluding to earlier. 373 00:48:26,110 --> 00:48:33,880 So and these messianic elites call for cosmopolitanism as a fig leaf to do their own thing, their mission. 374 00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,690 So if there is a cunning of reason, as you were saying, 375 00:48:38,350 --> 00:48:44,650 does it not operate precisely through the anti-politics of the European Union's founders and elites, 376 00:48:45,190 --> 00:48:54,700 which have led us the cunning of reason to the inescapable party of what we could call the third transformation of democracy a la Robert Doyle. 377 00:48:55,660 --> 00:49:01,870 And if that's the case, then shouldn't Eurosceptics not rejoice for this cunning of reason? 378 00:49:02,980 --> 00:49:09,310 Which then leads me to your very important changing landscape of power. 379 00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:17,680 Just two quick points. You say Britain is the greater victim of the division between the euro have and have nots. 380 00:49:18,070 --> 00:49:26,410 You were saying this a moment ago, but what do you think of the fact that perhaps a majority of people in this country do not see it that way? 381 00:49:26,860 --> 00:49:37,150 Even there, even if they're pro-EU, they think they have the best of all worlds, the EU and not just the single market minus the euro. 382 00:49:37,900 --> 00:49:47,850 That's brilliant. That is that this attractiveness is the real Achilles heel of proponents of the no is what Clegg means when he tries out, 383 00:49:48,280 --> 00:49:53,110 when he cries out that leaving the EU would amount to monumental economic vandalism. 384 00:49:53,470 --> 00:49:56,830 That's what he means. So. That's the real question. 385 00:49:56,830 --> 00:50:01,540 The constructive Eurosceptics that you want to appeal to and not just in Britain, 386 00:50:01,540 --> 00:50:08,240 by the way, you might want to ask you is can your cosmopolitan vision accommodate support? 387 00:50:08,260 --> 00:50:15,880 Very pragmatically, this is politics for this for a minimal version of reform and repatriate agenda. 388 00:50:16,930 --> 00:50:22,270 When you go back and speak in Berlin, or is that giving too much to Cameron and the Tories, 389 00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:31,220 is it really giving too much to acknowledge that European federalism, and we can call it that way, ought to be about cycles of federalism? 390 00:50:31,240 --> 00:50:36,790 That's what federalism always has been about. Aren't the Eurosceptics the real federalist? 391 00:50:36,820 --> 00:50:41,500 Oh, my God. And my answer to all this is yes. 392 00:50:41,500 --> 00:50:45,790 But we can have a conversation. You can accommodate this Eurosceptic vision. 393 00:50:46,510 --> 00:50:50,050 Which brings us to the second point on the changing of power, 394 00:50:51,340 --> 00:50:59,380 the German question and indeed today and in this wonderful little book, which I really recommend to all of you, 395 00:51:00,250 --> 00:51:08,080 your German Europe, you have denounced courageously Germany's neo hegemony in our new accidental empire, 396 00:51:08,410 --> 00:51:11,500 and you have been admired all over Europe for doing so. 397 00:51:12,520 --> 00:51:20,520 Indeed, we do admire in general Germans. Often you'll see an, you know, self-restraint, restraint by our hands. 398 00:51:20,530 --> 00:51:34,090 Please take me to the mast. But can we not grant more cleverly, as you beautifully put it, a nod to her own Eurosceptics, 399 00:51:34,840 --> 00:51:44,319 that responsibility to others across Europe cannot be detached to responsiveness to the self and therefore a respectful yes, 400 00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:46,710 but a dual guy into Greek finance. 401 00:51:46,720 --> 00:51:58,570 Sorry your son and other in the room and link to this point use you speak eloquently of the obfuscation of European interests, 402 00:51:59,530 --> 00:52:09,400 but couldn't we argue that if the solutions to the crisis are to be democratically sustainable on the creditor front and debit or front, 403 00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:16,210 should there be such a thing as a European interest that is distinct from enlightened national interest? 404 00:52:16,270 --> 00:52:25,000 After all, when sugar and an example you give in your book advocates raising German workers wages. 405 00:52:25,330 --> 00:52:27,700 Is this not simply good for them? You know, 406 00:52:27,700 --> 00:52:37,570 they can spend the extra time off and the extra money on southern beaches and the Southerners will spend more buying German goodies in return. 407 00:52:38,050 --> 00:52:41,320 So it's all about national interest, isn't it? 408 00:52:43,030 --> 00:52:49,600 Or is it? But if it is or is to grant me this, then Eurosceptics might not be that unhappy with your cosmopolitanism. 409 00:52:50,350 --> 00:53:00,730 And to be sure, to be sure, we do need to fend together in the world risk society that you have so cogently analysed, you know, for, for so long. 410 00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:07,690 But if Europe as a community of destiny has its role to play in this global risk game, 411 00:53:08,470 --> 00:53:18,280 how can cosmopolitan institution counter the continued tendencies of of of their role to socialise, risk and privatise benefit? 412 00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:28,020 Can cosmopolitan institution do all that work and should facing risk together as Europeans preclude us from going bankrupt alone? 413 00:53:29,620 --> 00:53:36,760 Should it? I don't know. Which brings me to our shared bed noire, and I completely agree with you. 414 00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:40,930 Mythological nationalism, as you reminded everyone earlier, 415 00:53:41,170 --> 00:53:49,660 the tendency we have in the social science to analyse all political forms in the modern world through the prism of the nation state. 416 00:53:51,130 --> 00:53:58,510 Yes, but the question becomes, can cosmopolitanism really avoid the risk of cloning the state at the European level? 417 00:53:58,510 --> 00:54:04,690 And I know you say yes, but despite your best intention, can it do that? 418 00:54:05,560 --> 00:54:14,950 Cannot avoid state writ large at the European level without accepting that mythological nationalisms still belong to nation state, 419 00:54:14,950 --> 00:54:21,760 that they have a role to play in our world. Isn't it the case that in the age of crowdfunding and distributed networked intelligence, 420 00:54:22,060 --> 00:54:25,570 large scale phenomena often do not go for large scale governance. 421 00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:30,379 And that's your Europe as emancipation, obviously. But but at the same time, 422 00:54:30,380 --> 00:54:37,780 it it may be the case that your version of Cosmopolitan may escape the Eurosceptic 423 00:54:37,780 --> 00:54:42,790 legitimate fear of loss of local control if they don't control national politics. 424 00:54:42,790 --> 00:54:47,530 In other words, you do call a Europe from for a Europe from below. 425 00:54:47,830 --> 00:54:53,440 I think many of us in this room will agree with you and call for that. 426 00:54:53,440 --> 00:55:00,489 Europe for below. From below. But why should it express yourself only through itself, only through cities? 427 00:55:00,490 --> 00:55:05,170 And I love the point that cities are more progressive than countries or regional politics, 428 00:55:05,410 --> 00:55:08,980 but not above all, through national politics at the end of the day. 429 00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:18,849 Should we not instead recognise in a cosmopolitan way the primacy of national politics and European 430 00:55:18,850 --> 00:55:26,319 democracy and simply wish for a union of peoples both as free as possible from each others, 431 00:55:26,320 --> 00:55:33,070 interference or interference from Brussels and Berlin, while at the same time radically open to each other, 432 00:55:33,070 --> 00:55:36,820 as you said, the forced inclusion of the excluded others. 433 00:55:37,390 --> 00:55:49,120 So the idea of democracy is not just a kind of like a mild, benign sovereign, this kind of thing, because it's all about enforcing that, 434 00:55:49,120 --> 00:55:58,360 trying to say that Europe should empower national democracies and make them healthy, fight against the democratisation as we see it so often. 435 00:55:58,810 --> 00:56:04,090 But at the same time that these are not good old national democracies, they should be radically open to each other. 436 00:56:04,210 --> 00:56:12,640 And if we say that, then how much do we really need the cosmopolitan superstructure or what kind of cosmopolitan superstructure do we really need? 437 00:56:13,090 --> 00:56:21,100 And if we if that brings us to the identity front and your call for the metamorphosis of the national citizen into a European citizen. 438 00:56:21,850 --> 00:56:31,300 Yes. Yeah, but yes and no. As we commemorate World War One, you know, turning French peasant into Frenchmen. 439 00:56:31,960 --> 00:56:37,720 Well, that didn't only bring good stuff. But then what should we necessarily want to turn them into? 440 00:56:37,720 --> 00:56:41,550 Euro men? As a French woman, I have my doubts, but. 441 00:56:42,790 --> 00:56:52,270 And in fact, as a Franco Greek citizen married to a Brit, I'm also for your own version of this Mediterranean wedding bed. 442 00:56:53,080 --> 00:56:59,470 But. But why a single wedding bed rather than wedding bells all around Europe? 443 00:57:00,890 --> 00:57:06,670 You know, we should take romantic pluralism seriously. I don't want to go too far down this metaphor here. 444 00:57:06,970 --> 00:57:12,879 I'm in a bit in trouble. But my basic point is, why should we need one story for Europe? 445 00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:22,120 Even a cosmopolitan story isn't rather the combination of the diversity of European stories into a grand and extravagant polyphony, 446 00:57:22,360 --> 00:57:26,259 even cacophony that is the ultimate European story. 447 00:57:26,260 --> 00:57:29,469 Or in Umberto Eco, those term is in translation. 448 00:57:29,470 --> 00:57:33,270 The only common language of Europe. Cool. 449 00:57:33,460 --> 00:57:39,790 Indeed. I do believe your call for Germans and Greeks to share bull rather than bullets. 450 00:57:40,570 --> 00:57:44,980 Isn't that cool? More consistent indeed. 451 00:57:45,070 --> 00:57:50,709 Sharing boule rather than bullet with we the peoples of Europe rather than a European. 452 00:57:50,710 --> 00:57:55,000 We more consistent with an ethos of mutual recognition and an engagement. 453 00:57:55,540 --> 00:57:59,859 Then a European demos and that. And I know that you share this belief. 454 00:57:59,860 --> 00:58:03,310 And can we not therefore say that if we can articulate this vision, 455 00:58:03,730 --> 00:58:12,550 these these Eurosceptics of the constructive kind you want to appeal to, indeed might might have a chance in the story. 456 00:58:12,910 --> 00:58:23,320 So to conclude two thoughts on connecting the internal and the external ambition for a cosmopolitan Europe that you have shared with us. 457 00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:33,340 First thought you call for reinventing modernity in Europe, and to be sure, if this is about reflexive modernisation of you, 458 00:58:33,580 --> 00:58:43,059 as you've discussed brilliantly in your work, and I am all for it, but even so, 459 00:58:43,060 --> 00:58:51,750 should we not be wary of epistemological and ontological risk in reinventing a 460 00:58:51,790 --> 00:58:56,110 kind of new standards of of civilisation under the guise of European modernity, 461 00:58:56,590 --> 00:59:02,049 which we will claim to be perhaps a bit a kind of experimental model for the rest of the world. 462 00:59:02,050 --> 00:59:12,910 Isn't it time to let go of any kind of Eurocentric civilizational conceits, universalism, and embrace Europe as really an evanescent, 463 00:59:12,910 --> 00:59:20,500 cosmopolitan idea and evanescent mediator, happy with its humble contribution to global reinvention? 464 00:59:20,500 --> 00:59:32,350 And secondly, second, closing thought. And lastly, Tim, och, I agree with you that we should all be European cosmopolitan, I grant you that, 465 00:59:32,890 --> 00:59:40,900 and that we should be able to tell Ukrainians we want our boots on the ground and Russians who who actually don't, 466 00:59:41,950 --> 00:59:46,180 that we are not tension as Europe because we are weak. 467 00:59:46,420 --> 00:59:50,290 We are weak because we are Kantian. Yes, we can't. 468 00:59:50,830 --> 01:00:01,750 Oh, but but would you not then agree with me that to be faithful to Kant's cosmopolitan conditional hospitality, 469 01:00:02,050 --> 01:00:10,720 we need our good old nation states to provide love and care to the Ukrainian refugees when if they come, hopefully they won't. 470 01:00:11,020 --> 01:00:15,030 And to. Grab Russian assets when they tried to leave ours. 471 01:00:15,420 --> 01:00:23,130 In other words, that what we need in Europe is state cosmopolitanism or rooted cosmopolitanism, 472 01:00:23,490 --> 01:00:31,560 the kind that starts with selling cosmopolitan zation at home and which may be 473 01:00:31,740 --> 01:00:37,410 mature Euroskeptics might come to accept and therefore embrace your vision. 474 01:00:47,160 --> 01:00:50,130 Thank you very much, Calypso, for a splendid challenge. David. 475 01:00:58,860 --> 01:01:07,440 Well, it is really a great privilege to have been asked to come here to respond to this. 476 01:01:07,650 --> 01:01:16,200 Fifth down law Fletcher I worked with Ralph in the commission in Brussels and in the House of Lords, 477 01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:25,800 and I admired his intellect enormously and above all his skill at bringing out into the open, 478 01:01:26,310 --> 01:01:31,530 often complex and contradictory tendencies in society and politics. 479 01:01:32,860 --> 01:01:40,150 It's a privilege to to follow Professor Beck, whose fascinating and thought provoking lecture we've just heard. 480 01:01:41,410 --> 01:01:44,840 And I'm not in agreement with every word he said. 481 01:01:44,860 --> 01:01:56,679 Tim, you did tell me. I was meant to be a bit controversial, but I would very much strongly agree with his view that recent Russian actions in 482 01:01:56,680 --> 01:02:05,319 Crimea and Ukraine do pose a fundamental challenge to European solidarity and to our 483 01:02:05,320 --> 01:02:12,610 attachment to a rules based and human rights based international order a challenge to 484 01:02:12,610 --> 01:02:18,340 which our response will be central to the future development of the European Union. 485 01:02:19,270 --> 01:02:22,840 But if I could, having agreed with that, take issue with another point. 486 01:02:23,590 --> 01:02:31,899 I would really question a bit the way in which the outcry that has arisen over the 487 01:02:31,900 --> 01:02:37,690 US National Security Agency's activities and the whole issue of data protection, 488 01:02:38,200 --> 01:02:43,390 whether it is not being addressed in a rather one sided way. 489 01:02:44,080 --> 01:02:53,620 In my analysis, the communication revolution of recent years the Internet, mobile phones, digital applications, 490 01:02:53,620 --> 01:03:03,190 all that has brought with it a massive positive boost to individual freedoms and opportunities, 491 01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:10,600 an enlargement of them far beyond our imagining when they were first being developed. 492 01:03:11,200 --> 01:03:18,549 But it has had its dark side to think only of transnational child pornography or the scope for 493 01:03:18,550 --> 01:03:25,570 terrorists and religious fundamentalists to ply their trades in dealing with these challenges. 494 01:03:25,960 --> 01:03:36,370 State institutions need to find a new balance between protecting their citizens and protecting their citizens privacy. 495 01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:40,600 And that's not proving easy or straightforward. 496 01:03:41,170 --> 01:03:43,060 It would be surprising if it was. 497 01:03:44,080 --> 01:03:53,290 But it is a balance, I would argue, that needs to be struck both at the national the European and the international level. 498 01:03:54,330 --> 01:04:04,530 And then a brief disclaimer, the remarks I'm going to make in response to today's lecture. 499 01:04:05,850 --> 01:04:16,740 We'll be those of a practitioner and not an academic, and they will reflect a British mindset, albeit the mindset of a Briton, 500 01:04:16,920 --> 01:04:25,980 much of whose professional life has been devoted to Britain's participation in the European cause, 501 01:04:26,460 --> 01:04:35,370 over which the possibility of any referendum in 2017 now casts a deep and baleful shadow. 502 01:04:36,330 --> 01:04:45,620 Now. I would agree. There is no doubt whatsoever that the European project needs urgently needs resuscitation. 503 01:04:46,370 --> 01:04:52,939 European elections at the end of May are likely to lead to a sharp increase in votes for 504 01:04:52,940 --> 01:05:01,610 anti-EU or anti euro parties and in the number of seats they hold in the European Parliament. 505 01:05:02,900 --> 01:05:11,120 That, in parenthesis, may not much change the European Parliament's ability to operate and take decisions. 506 01:05:11,570 --> 01:05:16,670 If, as I believe will be the case, the three main groups the Socialists, 507 01:05:16,670 --> 01:05:22,730 the Christians and the Liberals work more closely together in the future than they've done in the past. 508 01:05:23,270 --> 01:05:33,380 And also, given the remarkably vociferous and nationalistic nature of the anti euro anti-EU parties. 509 01:05:34,760 --> 01:05:44,160 Moreover, these protest movements, which is what they are, are more widespread than ever before in UK. 510 01:05:44,180 --> 01:05:51,500 You have UKIP in France, the Foreign Minister, now in Holland you have little does is Peavey. 511 01:05:52,280 --> 01:06:00,320 You have true Finns, true Swedes. In Italy you have five star Greece, you have Golden Dawn, in Hungary you have Jobbik. 512 01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:07,100 So we must not think that these can simply be wished away. 513 01:06:08,380 --> 01:06:21,040 But how best are we to respond? I doubt very much myself the viability of a great grassroots movement from below. 514 01:06:22,030 --> 01:06:27,910 I would be staked with reasonable certainty that it wouldn't work in this country. 515 01:06:29,080 --> 01:06:34,510 It could actually widen the gap between Britain and some others. 516 01:06:35,680 --> 01:06:43,690 The gap between Britain on one side and, say, the Scandinavian countries and some East Europeans on the one hand, 517 01:06:44,290 --> 01:06:48,820 and more integrationist federalist member states on the other. 518 01:06:49,480 --> 01:06:52,750 And if I could be allowed a short digression on semantics. 519 01:06:53,500 --> 01:07:00,400 After all, in Oxford with certainty, when I was here, the School of Philosophy spent a lot of its time talking about semantics. 520 01:07:00,910 --> 01:07:06,340 The capacity of the British to misunderstand certain words is highly developed. 521 01:07:06,730 --> 01:07:18,550 Take federalism. Federalism, which we honestly believe to be a centralising proposition based on, of course, 522 01:07:18,670 --> 01:07:25,510 the American example and ignore totally the German example, which is exactly the opposite. 523 01:07:26,320 --> 01:07:32,980 Take the word intellectual. In France, to be called a public intellectual is a compliment. 524 01:07:33,640 --> 01:07:38,080 In this country, it is an insult to give and take. 525 01:07:38,320 --> 01:07:47,230 And here I forgive hope. I may be forgiven if I could pick up the word cosmopolitan, a very dangerous word in this country, I have to say. 526 01:07:47,710 --> 01:07:54,160 One of our junior ministers recently managed to insult the prime minister inadvertently, of course, 527 01:07:54,640 --> 01:08:01,180 by saying that those who were in favour of migration were mainly in favour in order to have foreign nannies. 528 01:08:01,480 --> 01:08:08,470 Having forgotten that the Prime Minister had one, but he did not use the word cosmopolitan elite as a compliment. 529 01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:12,580 And so I think there is a risk in that word. 530 01:08:13,830 --> 01:08:18,150 In this country, not in the concept, but in the world of risk. 531 01:08:18,660 --> 01:08:24,629 Now, such an approach, if we are, how should we respond? 532 01:08:24,630 --> 01:08:35,340 Then I would argue myself that it is better to fight emotional appeals to the past with rational appeals to the future. 533 01:08:36,210 --> 01:08:44,520 Such an approach would need to combine positive aspects clearly a broad policy reform agenda, 534 01:08:45,330 --> 01:08:55,740 and it would combine that with negative aspects the absence and the unconvincing nature of the alternatives available to all Europeans. 535 01:08:56,610 --> 01:09:05,339 If I was asked what that positive reform agenda would consist of, I would put forward roughly the following. 536 01:09:05,340 --> 01:09:09,180 And it would be a positive policy reform agenda. 537 01:09:09,810 --> 01:09:13,860 It would involve, of course, completing the single market in services. 538 01:09:13,860 --> 01:09:19,260 In particular, it would involve creating a level playing field for digital. 539 01:09:19,890 --> 01:09:26,900 It would involve an energy single market and much greater effective energy security. 540 01:09:26,910 --> 01:09:33,660 And the Ukraine issue has put the spotlight back on that very happily, in my view. 541 01:09:34,470 --> 01:09:40,200 It would involve a common foreign and security policy which could really deal 542 01:09:40,200 --> 01:09:48,360 with the problems being posed by President Putin's newly developed theses, 543 01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:55,560 which, alas, bear all too close resemblance to others we have heard earlier in the last century. 544 01:09:57,090 --> 01:10:07,350 We I would include in my list of policy areas much greater defence cooperation in order to cope with the problems of austerity budgets. 545 01:10:07,950 --> 01:10:15,809 We need free and fair trade on a worldwide basis, which would involve reviving the World Trade Organisation, 546 01:10:15,810 --> 01:10:23,070 which made a little bit of progress in Bali to try and complete the Doha round and also to 547 01:10:23,070 --> 01:10:29,219 complete the set of free trade agreements which are being negotiated by Europe with Canada, 548 01:10:29,220 --> 01:10:39,230 Japan, the United States and perhaps Brazil. I would look to see a renewed leadership by Europe on climate change. 549 01:10:39,890 --> 01:10:48,830 The completion of Balkan enlargement and an item that's often overlooked and I think here meets a point the 550 01:10:48,830 --> 01:10:59,330 Calypso is making a more a more structured role for national parliaments in the shaping of European legislation. 551 01:10:59,810 --> 01:11:05,389 The European Union Select Committee, which Tim made a reference, 552 01:11:05,390 --> 01:11:12,560 has just written a report on that and how you could enhance the role of national parliaments without treaty change. 553 01:11:13,220 --> 01:11:19,850 There are a lot of things you could do, and I believe that that is a way of reinforcing not the only way, 554 01:11:20,180 --> 01:11:30,020 but part of the way of reinforcing what is called the dealing with the democratic deficit, but in a way that is less sweeping than some of the others. 555 01:11:31,640 --> 01:11:37,670 I would not, therefore in my list include a sweeping treaty change, 556 01:11:38,480 --> 01:11:43,880 although there may need to be one or two tweaks to the present treaties for the eurozone members. 557 01:11:43,910 --> 01:11:53,569 I suspect that will be the case. I don't think there is really an appetite for sweeping treaty change across Europe and the 558 01:11:53,570 --> 01:12:00,080 referendum's likely to be triggered by any treaty that contained that could very well fail. 559 01:12:00,500 --> 01:12:02,900 And it would be pretty disastrous, frankly, 560 01:12:03,290 --> 01:12:10,730 if Europe spent the next few years negotiating such changes and then the years following that in failing to ratify them. 561 01:12:12,840 --> 01:12:21,990 There have actually been far too many institutional based reforms, treaties in the last 20 years. 562 01:12:22,650 --> 01:12:25,950 If you look at the list, it's a bit terrifying, really. 563 01:12:26,340 --> 01:12:30,569 The Single European Act. Maastricht, Amsterdam knees. 564 01:12:30,570 --> 01:12:40,010 The Constitutional Treaty. Lisbon I reckon we could have done with at least two or three of those, but they. 565 01:12:40,680 --> 01:12:47,190 The key thing is that that institutional approach, as opposed to the policy based approach to reform, 566 01:12:47,190 --> 01:12:55,500 which I would suggest is the right one, that institution based approach hasn't mustered support for the European Union. 567 01:12:55,830 --> 01:13:01,140 If anything, the contrary, as we're seeing with the voting next month. 568 01:13:02,100 --> 01:13:10,679 And in the end, I would suggest that the success of the European project depends on building 569 01:13:10,680 --> 01:13:17,190 across many historical faultlines and many cultural and political differences. 570 01:13:17,850 --> 01:13:25,320 It cannot be done by trying to eliminate those we have to construct across those fault lines, 571 01:13:25,890 --> 01:13:35,010 which means that you need solid foundations on both sides of the fault lines and not too ambitious a structure on top. 572 01:13:36,730 --> 01:13:43,540 I don't myself think that there is any future or any sense in what is called a two speed Europe, 573 01:13:44,110 --> 01:13:50,260 but we will, I am convinced, need a good deal of variable geometry. 574 01:13:50,740 --> 01:14:00,670 Europe has already been pretty good at defining variable geometry both in the membership and non membership of the euro in the Schengen area, 575 01:14:00,670 --> 01:14:07,240 in the Justice and Home Affairs area, and now emerging on banking union. 576 01:14:07,600 --> 01:14:15,460 And I don't think that there is any reason to believe that the concept of variable geometry couldn't be developed further. 577 01:14:16,270 --> 01:14:18,010 So last word. 578 01:14:18,550 --> 01:14:31,360 Just remember, I would suggest that the lamented constitutional treaty which was defeated, opposed as the motto of Europe unity in diversity. 579 01:14:31,990 --> 01:14:39,490 And perhaps we should always look at Europe as one of these cases where the best is frequently the enemy of the good.